Lidl parking fine

larkhall123

Hi all,

We received a fine from Parking Eye via Zipcar claiming that we did not enter the details of the car when shopping at Lidl. We do not have a car and exceptionally we hired a zipcar to pick up some furniture and as we had some spare time before giving back the car we went to lidl to do some extra shopping. We were absolutely unaware of this and it is not clearly indicated in the shop and at the till that you need to register the car number in a machine. Therefore I want to appeal for this fine. I have seen lots of posts on that but i am not clear which template to use (on these links: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5703794"nofollow" href="https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/69859059#Comment_69859059" title="Link: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/69859059#Comment_69859059">https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/69859059#Comment_69859059) can someone help here please? Note zipcar already took the money and also charged £15 for processing the fine!Can i contest this fee too? any advice will be very much appreciated.

Many thanks for your help in advance 
Virginie

Umkomaas

Have you received a Notice to Hirer, addressed to you, directly from ParkingEye, or has Zipcar simply passed their notice to you, telling you to get on with dealing with it?  Important nuance we need to understand before more substantive advice. 

Coupon-mad

Use the Edna Basher version, as the NEWBIES thread says.  Obviously no ticking 'driver' in the appeals box/menu.

larkhall123

Thanks - We received an email from zipcar notifiying us of the parking ticket in which they attach the PCN from Parking Eye (i don't see notice to hirer mentionned) and the charge for processing the parking ticket from zipcar. Maybe worth mentionning the car was hired end of april and we only received the fine a week ago..
I will take a look at the EDNA Basher thanks!

Fruitcake

It is not a fine.

You need to tell Zipcar they must NOT pay the parking charge and must instruct ParkingEye to send you a notice to hirer. Unless and until they do, Zipcar will remain liable.
You can do nothing until you have a NTH in your own name.

Zipcar should know this because it has been the law for ten years. Point them to the PoFA 2012.
If Zipcar are a BVRLA member, then they should also know about this because their trade association has told them not to pay private parking charges but instead to transfer liability to the hirer.

To transfer liability Zipcar need to fill in and send of the slip on the NTK, naming you as hirer.

If Zipcar paid the parking charge, then you need to dispute that with your bank/card provider and do a charge back, plus complain to Zipcar.
By paying the charge they have removed your right to appeal.

You need to check the hire Ts and Cs to see what it says about paying parking charges from unregulated private parking companies. Note these are not fines or penalties, nor are they issued by an authority.

larkhall123

Zipcar is listed as a BVRLA member. In their T&Cs it says that if they receive a ticket after the reservation has ended, i am responsible for it and if they cannot redirect it (not sure why they cannot though), they will pay the fine provided that they are no ground to appeal. It also says that I can appeal provided the issuing authority allows me to and I have valid grounds to do so.. that doesn't sound quite right! I have contacted Zipcar based on your recommendation 

Fruitcake

What specifically does the hire agreement say? Does it only mention fines, penalties, and an authority, or does it specifically mention parking charge notices from unregulated private parking companies?

It is extremely important for you to determine this.

In any case, the BVRLA has told its members not to pay PCNs from private parking companies, but to inform the PPC of the hirer's details. Irrespective of whether or not the hire agreement has a clause about private parking companies, their trade association has told them not to pay them.
In addition, paying the charge denies you the right to an appeal which is an unfair contract term and breaches the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

If Zipcar have paid the charge, you should be doing a charge back from your bank/card provider.

What happened when you complained to the store manager and/or CEO and your MP?

larkhall123

Hi,

Thanks for your help.

Zipcar responded saying 'the right of appeal is held by the registered owner of the vehicle in this case it is zipcar. We are unable to transfer liability on this violation or this would have been done. I understand this is a frustrating situation but we need you to remember that PCNs are not issued by zipcar but by the local authority. We try to accommodate our members as best as we can but we as a company need to recover the costs of these fines from the members responsible."

I have checked again the T&Cs but it only says the following: 

Traffic Violations

You are responsible for legal infractions. If we receive a notice and process a violation, you will be charged a £15 processing fee in addition to the original cost of the ticket. 

What happens if I receive a ticket after my reservation has ended? 

If the ticket was issued as a result of your reservation, you are responsible for it. Once we are notified about the ticket, we will charge you a £15 processing fee. If we can, we will redirect the violation to you. If we can't redirect it, we will pay the fine, along with any late fees and bill the total to your account, provided that there are no grounds to appeal. You will be able to appeal the fine provided the issuing authority allows you to and that you have valid grounds to do so. You will be informed of the process via email.

Do I need to liaise with Parking Eye then?

Half_way

No traffic violation has taken place, neither has there been any "legal infraction"  ( seriously who wrote this? it sounds American)

 There has been no fine, and what was issued was certainly not issued by any authority.

Please make sure that you do not refer to it as a fine when you deal with Zip car ( or any other rental company)  or use any terms such as penalty, infraction or even attempt to describe Parking eye as an authority.

Get back to Zip car and query the charge as it appears they have made an error in charging you this and as such they must make a refund in full as this charge from "parking eye"  is not covered by their terms and conditions

Fruitcake

larkhall123 said:

Zipcar responded saying 'the right of appeal is held by the registered owner of the vehicle in this case it is zipcar. We are unable to transfer liability on this violation or this would have been done. I understand this is a frustrating situation but we need you to remember that PCNs are not issued by zipcar but by the local authority. We try to accommodate our members as best as we can but we as a company need to recover the costs of these fines from the members responsible."

There is so much wrong with that paragraph.

There is no such thing as a registered owner in the UK.
The PCN was not issued by the local authority.
They are not fines.

The registered keeper had the right to transfer liability to the hirer by simply filling in and sending off the tear off strip on the bottom of the NTK. By not doing so they have remained liable and at the same time they have denied you the right to appeal.
This has been the law for ten years, and the BVRLA have already told them this, and told them not to pay PCNs from private parking companies.

You are not liable for the charge.
You never were liable for the charge because they never transferred liability to the hirer.

ParkingEye are no longer involved.


You should,

Tell Zipcar the above, pointing out the contract only refers to traffic violations and fines from an issuing authority, not private parking charges from an unregulated private parking company. Also point out that you have never received a ticket and therefore this remains the sole responsibility of Zipcar.
Also note that even the Ts and Cs you mention above say they will redirect the charge to you, which they didn't, and mentions an appeal process.

Complain to their CEO
Complain to the BVRLA
Complain to the landowner
Complain to your MP
Do a chargeback/put the charge in dispute, tell Zipcar what you have done, and warn them that you will commence a court claim against them if you do not get your money back. Give them two weeks to do this, then send an LBC if you don't get satisfaction.

larkhall123

thanks so much! awaiting zipcar's response now, hopefully they won't block my zipcar account
i will get back to you once i hear from them