New cost per Kw of gas and electric.

pensioner2

If it is possible to work out that the price cap for an average user is £2500, why is it taking so long to give the information nearly everyone needs about the unit cost per Kw?
Why is there still no choice to avoid the  standing charges?
Why is there no provision of Credit and Load meters to encourage more customers to avoid peak usage?

GingerTim

We don't have the information on the unit cost, and probably won't until things settle down after yesterday.

For what the standing charge covers, see https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6339555/mse-update-why-has-the-standing-charge-for-electricity-nearly-doubled#latest

[Deleted User]

pensioner2 said:

If it is possible to work out that the price cap for an average user is £2500, why is it taking so long to give the information nearly everyone needs about the unit cost per Kw?

HM EII

pensioner2 said:

Why is there still no choice to avoid the  standing charges?

Because you still need the grid to be there.

pensioner2 said:

Why is there no provision of Credit and Load meters to encourage more customers to avoid peak usage?

That's what smart meters can do (and already do for some tariffs).

pensioner2

The present smart meters only do a fraction of what the C.A.L.M.U. meter I took part in the trial for, even with 1982 technology.    Consumers will only adjust the timing of their energy use to help providers if there is an easy to understand incentive.    What progress has there been in 40 years

[Deleted User]

The present smart meters do plenty of things.  There are customers right now who get signals on the display in their house or on their mobile phone to say that the price has dropped and it is a good time to switch things on (or conversely that the price is high and they should consider turning things off).

What other "easy to understand" incentive would you like?

Astria

[Deleted User] said:

The present smart meters do plenty of things.  There are customers right now who get signals on the display in their house or on their mobile phone to say that the price has dropped and it is a good time to switch things on (or conversely that the price is high and they should consider turning things off).

What other "easy to understand" incentive would you like?

Considering providers can't even upload correct tariffs to smart meters at times I wouldn't like to think how reliable that would be!

An easier/better way would be to include the times in the tariff, such as 12am->6am @ 10p, 6am->6pm @ 35p, 6pm->midnight @ 55p.

brewerdave

pensioner2 said:

The present smart meters only do a fraction of what the C.A.L.M.U. meter I took part in the trial for, even with 1982 technology.    Consumers will only adjust the timing of their energy use to help providers if there is an easy to understand incentive.    What progress has there been in 40 years

The last HMG report in August said that there were still less than 50% of all domestic meters operating in smart mode in the UK. (In the case of gas meters the figure is well below 50%) -until this number is increased considerably then there is little mileage in offering very flexible tariffs - and after yesterday's announcements even less incentive for the suppliers.

[Deleted User]

Astria said:

[Deleted User] said:

The present smart meters do plenty of things.  There are customers right now who get signals on the display in their house or on their mobile phone to say that the price has dropped and it is a good time to switch things on (or conversely that the price is high and they should consider turning things off).

What other "easy to understand" incentive would you like?

Considering providers can't even upload correct tariffs to smart meters at times I wouldn't like to think how reliable that would be!

An easier/better way would be to include the times in the tariff, such as 12am->6am @ 10p, 6am->6pm @ 35p, 6pm->midnight @ 55p.

But that would be fixed at the signing of the contract and therefore wouldn't be dynamic to follow demand as the OP suggested they needed.  Effectively, you've just said "put everyone on Economy 10".

I think the people who are using it (Octopus Agile??) seem to find it accurate and easy to deal with - I'm not on one of these tariffs so I don't know.

Interestingly, I was involved with a trial where people would get free electricity for the whole day on any day when they charged their EV or ran their tumble dryer overnight.  Only 5 out of the 45 participants changed their behaviour.

Astria

[Deleted User] said:

Astria said:

Deleted_User said:

The present smart meters do plenty of things.  There are customers right now who get signals on the display in their house or on their mobile phone to say that the price has dropped and it is a good time to switch things on (or conversely that the price is high and they should consider turning things off).

What other "easy to understand" incentive would you like?

Considering providers can't even upload correct tariffs to smart meters at times I wouldn't like to think how reliable that would be!

An easier/better way would be to include the times in the tariff, such as 12am->6am @ 10p, 6am->6pm @ 35p, 6pm->midnight @ 55p.

But that would be fixed at the signing of the contract and therefore wouldn't be dynamic to follow demand as the OP suggested they needed.  Effectively, you've just said "put everyone on Economy 10".

I think the people who are using it (Octopus Agile??) seem to find it accurate and easy to deal with - I'm not on one of these tariffs so I don't know.

Interestingly, I was involved with a trial where people would get free electricity for the whole day on any day when they charged their EV or ran their tumble dryer overnight.  Only 5 out of the 45 participants changed their behaviour.

Could that be because other people are saying that using appliances over night without supervision, such as washing machines and tumble driers is a bad idea? EV is about the only thing I'd trust over night, and even that is a risk and should ideally be done outside rather than a closed room or garage.

[Deleted User]

Astria said:

[Deleted User] said:

Astria said:

Deleted_User said:

The present smart meters do plenty of things.  There are customers right now who get signals on the display in their house or on their mobile phone to say that the price has dropped and it is a good time to switch things on (or conversely that the price is high and they should consider turning things off).

What other "easy to understand" incentive would you like?

Considering providers can't even upload correct tariffs to smart meters at times I wouldn't like to think how reliable that would be!

An easier/better way would be to include the times in the tariff, such as 12am->6am @ 10p, 6am->6pm @ 35p, 6pm->midnight @ 55p.

But that would be fixed at the signing of the contract and therefore wouldn't be dynamic to follow demand as the OP suggested they needed.  Effectively, you've just said "put everyone on Economy 10".

I think the people who are using it (Octopus Agile??) seem to find it accurate and easy to deal with - I'm not on one of these tariffs so I don't know.

Interestingly, I was involved with a trial where people would get free electricity for the whole day on any day when they charged their EV or ran their tumble dryer overnight.  Only 5 out of the 45 participants changed their behaviour.

Could that be because other people are saying that using appliances over night without supervision, such as washing machines and tumble driers is a bad idea? EV is about the only thing I'd trust over night, and even that is a risk and should ideally be done outside rather than a closed room or garage.

It could be - "overnight" in the trial started at 10pm but that's late enough for the concern you raised.  The most common participant response we got was "I want to turn things on when I want them on" or similar.

pensioner2

The trial I took part in had 5 tariffs including economy 10.It also had a tariff for my utility room which could be interrupted for up to 2 hours.   We had a comparison with the original meter which remained in place.     We saved money by adjusting some of our usage times.      After considerable cost to consumers we have so called smart meters which have limited effectiveness.    I'm sure more people will change their behaviour if the rewards are available [however, I think enough people have the sense to use the system wisely}.  What progress in 40 years?