Get paid up to £6pkWh for not using big appliances in the evening?

chris1973

Eventually you'll create enough demand from appliances and EV Charging to create a second peak period, then wave goodbye to the discount.

Not sure how they can even offer these discounts, surely the cost of generating Electricity and importing additional LNG from Qatar and the U.S costs the same 24/7 regardless of the time of day - shifting demand doesn't negate or reduce the demand, it just moves it around. Which suggests that they could probably afford to offer the cheaper prices all day.

These actions aren't indicative of an energy crisis. Just more green indulgences being thrown at us.

QrizB

Not sure how they can even offer these discounts, surely the cost of generating Electricity and importing additional LNG from Qatar and the U.S costs the same 24/7 regardless of the time of day - shifting demand doesn't negate or reduce the demand, it just moves it around.

That's not how it works.

There are lots of ways of generating electricity. Ignoring the really small generators, wind, solar and nuclear run all the time. Next up the cost list you've got the CCGTs. If you need more power than can be provided by the CCGT fleet, you need to start up the OCGTs and the other peaker plants. These are less efficient than CCGTs and so the electricity from them costs more.

If you can shave the demand peak by sifting loads to other times, you don't need the peaker plants and the overall cost is less.

You can see the current generation mix with reasonable granularity here:
http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

rjmachin

Vincero said:

Petriix said:

I took part in the Octopus trial. Basically they know your average usage for any given time period and set you a target to use less than 60% of your average. If you do then all the energy you use becomes free.

There were a small number of participants who were asked to double their usage in some low demand periods.

As with many of these things, people willing to adapt their behaviour (rather than insisting on continuing to do everything exactly as they currently do) will be able to benefit. 

All of the energy during just that period or per day or what?

I could forsee in some cases people reducing their usage so much, but I don't think the amount they are talking about would address the upcoming overall bill shock for many.
People who could benefit most from this are ironically probably well off enough to have something like a Tesla Powerwall - charge up when cheap rate (or maybe even free / credit for use) and then deploy the energy when you need to reduce the grid usage and get paid for it....

The octopus trial gave you your energy usage for free during the time period (not all day).

For example, if you average 1.2kWh between 4pm - 6pm, if you reduce that to say 0.7kWh, they will give you a rebate of the 0.7kWh for that event/day.

As mentioned, when I took part, I for an example similar to above, I got a rebate of around 21p

phillw

chris1973 said:

surely the cost of generating Electricity and importing additional LNG from Qatar and the U.S costs the same 24/7 regardless of the time of day - shifting demand doesn't negate or reduce the demand, it just moves it around. Which suggests that they could probably afford to offer the cheaper prices all day.

These actions aren't indicative of an energy crisis. Just more green indulgences being thrown at us.

No, the cost of buying electricity varies greatly. It operates like the stock market, you can buy ahead of time or spot pricing on the hour. If your provider needs to buy electricity to close their position, and there is a lot of demand at that time then the price can go really high.

wild666

£6 at the present rates 28p per kWh would mean that each day it was used for saving I would get about 4 days usage back so my eclectic bill would be around £27 per month if they did it one day per week or I would be like the next 3 or 4 days of free electric, if it was five days of the week, I would be making around £19 per week on a 5 day of £6 so I couldn't see a supplier giving £6 credit to users unless it was once per month.

Mistral001

I am not saying it is a bad idea, but I am intrigued by the media who hail it as a new idea when surely this is just an off peak scheme and those have been around for 50 or 60 years.  I remember when off peak electricity for heating homes was very very common with the big storage heaters containing bricks which would store heat in off peak hours  and release it during peak hours. Even today your average Spar shop will stop using electricity from the grid for a few hours in the evening during peak hours and switch over to their own generators to get a discount on their electricity.  


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pete-20-11

Some info on the octopus trial : https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/lifestyle/money/energy-customers-national-grid-trial-27230234

I took part in six trials if I remember correctly, and got £1.60 credit. Also did the gas winter workout and got £7 (although I donated that to their charity fund).

I’ve got a battery now, so I’m not sure how much I’d save if they compared usage! That’s what they did on the trial - look at my average usage for that time period over the last four weeks and ask me to reduce my usual usage by say 1-2kWh. 

Charging different prices for different times isn’t exactly new as some say, but paying people to not use electricity is a bit new! Plus different prices for each half hour or certain 1-2 hour slots is new-ish.

longer term with things like intelligent octopus the supplier could charge your car when it’s best for the grid. You say when you need the car and how much it needs charging and it does the rest for you, I believe. 

Sea_Shell

pete-20-11 said:

Some info on the octopus trial : https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/lifestyle/money/energy-customers-national-grid-trial-27230234

I took part in six trials if I remember correctly, and got £1.60 credit. Also did the gas winter workout and got £7 (although I donated that to their charity fund).

I’ve got a battery now, so I’m not sure how much I’d save if they compared usage! That’s what they did on the trial - look at my average usage for that time period over the last four weeks and ask me to reduce my usual usage by say 1-2kWh. 

Charging different prices for different times isn’t exactly new as some say, but paying people to not use electricity is a bit new! Plus different prices for each half hour or certain 1-2 hour slots is new-ish.

longer term with things like intelligent octopus the supplier could charge your car when it’s best for the grid. You say when you need the car and how much it needs charging and it does the rest for you, I believe. 

Which does leave you exposed to the vaguries of the weather, especially as we head into Autumn.

Be a bit hard to cut down in week 5+, based on weeks 1 - 4, if the weather turns.

It might work as we exit winter into spring.

pete-20-11

They might do it a different way to octopus anyway.

plus it is more about moving your usage than cutting down. Perhaps putting the washing machine on earlier or later. Maybe even having dinner slightly earlier. If it’s worth it financially!