How many Energy Suppliers Will Survive?

[Deleted User]

I am really not sure why people are debating the pros and cons of nationalised industries. The simple truth is that as a Country we do not have the money to re-Nationalise anything UNTIL an existing contract comes to its natural end.

Also, if we set up ConGovEnergy tomorrow there is absolutely no guarantee that the energy supplied to customers would be any cheaper. One would assume - at least in the short term - it would be more expensive as there would be no hedging in place. The cost of supporting Bulb backs up this premise.

wittynamegoeshere

The_Green_Hornet said:

wittynamegoeshere said:

Openreach is a monopoly.  Perhaps if it was state run then everyone's bills would be lower?  This is how it's done in lots of countries.

Openreach isn't a monopoly.

You don't understand what a monopoly is.  Many people seem to think it means that there's absolutely no competition.  That's a load of rubbish, if true then monopolies would not exist.

Google might help you to understand.

jj_43

if there is a cold winter and if Putin takes advantage, it won't take much, several days before even the largest suppliers start talking to the government. Note there will be gas, but the price will be perhaps 5 times greater than currently for the coldest days, for gas that has not been brought yet.

wild666

njm123 said:

If you get non-payment at that level, the systems failed,   you have to put everyone on prepayment plans.

If everyone had to be put on prepayment then the extra charged for prepayment meters should be scrapped as this would effectively become the SVR.

Mobtr

Mstty said:

Mobtr said:

Mstty said:

All the big well established energy suppliers will survive. 

One reason is below

April 2022 £1971 price cap 2% profit = £39.42 per customer

Oct 2022 £3600 predicted price cap 2% profit £72 per customer

Where did you get this information from or is it just made up?

No I didn't make it up🤣🤣 it's published everywhere but here is one link

https://sse.co.uk/help/energy/gas-electricity-bill-payment/bill-price-breakdown

If you mean the £3600 price cap for October I did state predicted.

So if they’re all making a 2% profit, why have so many gone bust? 

Mobtr

macman said:

Mobtr said:

Mstty said:

All the big well established energy suppliers will survive. 

One reason is below

April 2022 £1971 price cap 2% profit = £39.42 per customer

Oct 2022 £3600 predicted price cap 2% profit £72 per customer

Where did you get this information from or is it just made up?

If you are disputing the 2%, then that is the official Ofgem margin in the price cap. I doubt many are even managing that now, because wholesale prices have exceeded all the estimates. 

If you mean do I think they’re making more, on the contrary, I don’t think the supply side of any energy firm in this country is making a profit due to having to buy it in for more than they can sell it for.  

Mstty

Mobtr said:

Mstty said:

Mobtr said:

Mstty said:

All the big well established energy suppliers will survive. 

One reason is below

April 2022 £1971 price cap 2% profit = £39.42 per customer

Oct 2022 £3600 predicted price cap 2% profit £72 per customer

Where did you get this information from or is it just made up?

No I didn't make it up🤣🤣 it's published everywhere but here is one link

https://sse.co.uk/help/energy/gas-electricity-bill-payment/bill-price-breakdown

If you mean the £3600 price cap for October I did state predicted.

So if they’re all making a 2% profit, why have so many gone bust? 

I didn't say they were all making 2% profit, I was supplying information on the designated slice of the energy pie for profits. The theoretical max if you like.

Most are making losses, some are making a small profit not close to 2%

I won't go into all the small, badly run companies that went bust that's been well documented and still being paid for by everyone.

There has obviously been some decent hedging going on at some of the suppliers as they have offered close to current Apr '22 cap prices to existing customers for 1-2 years from March '22 but it's not consistent and as we moved through this year there was only one trend.....upwards

littleteapot

Mobtr said:

macman said:

Mobtr said:

Mstty said:

All the big well established energy suppliers will survive. 

One reason is below

April 2022 £1971 price cap 2% profit = £39.42 per customer

Oct 2022 £3600 predicted price cap 2% profit £72 per customer

Where did you get this information from or is it just made up?

If you are disputing the 2%, then that is the official Ofgem margin in the price cap. I doubt many are even managing that now, because wholesale prices have exceeded all the estimates. 

If you mean do I think they’re making more, on the contrary, I don’t think the supply side of any energy firm in this country is making a profit due to having to buy it in for more than they can sell it for.  

They are/will probably make a loss on the domestic side, but can make this up on the business side where prices are not capped and are already generally much higher than the price cap.

prowla

My supplier is Shell; I'd expect them to survive, since they dig the gas out of the sea too.

MattMattMattUK

prowla said:

My supplier is Shell; I'd expect them to survive, since they dig the gas out of the sea too.

Shell the supplier (Shell Energy Retail Limited) is not the same company as Shell the exploration, extraction and processing company (Shell PLC). If the former were forced to sell below cost for any significant period of time it could easily become insolvent, if there was no realistic return to profit for several years the latter, which is the owner, would let it fail.