Oct price cap increase likely to push energy bill to over £10k... for a family of 4...

TheGardener

MariaAH said:

Halo572 said:

I haven't read all 41 pages of this, but it would seem to be down to a usage behaviour issue.

And I don't mean a helpful politician/helpful forum poster - reduce your usage comment, more the attitude of probably your sons.

I have a masters in Environmental Management and have been doing my own personal energy management for the past 20 years, my current Summer bill is around £60 for just me, last year it was £35.

Last Winter I was controlling the bills to £120 a month and that was with an average room temperature I wasn't in of 12 degrees.

I do have to consider my wide collection of house plants but they manged OK.

I don't know what I will do if they do not reverse the October price cap, other than pay another £80 a month for 12 degrees.

I am at the point to save I will need to stop using lights, using the TV, cooking, washing clothes, washing up and all the other everyday things that before April were normal throughout history, which is why anyone who says 'reduce' is ill informed and ignorant.  Looking at you daily standing charge.

Like others I can tell what I have used during the day - washing machine, dishwasher, desk fan, TV that puts the meter up more than 'normal'.  I can give you an approximate cost of using them as well.

You definitely need a meter, although you can (could) buy a wireless electricity monitor that connects to the mains inlet cable.  it measures the charge coming into the house through the main cable and works just like a smart meter.  I used this for years until I got a smart meter.

Thermometers in each room also help me, you may need to turn your thermostat down and live in a colder house, I aim for 16 in the rooms I am in and I find that bearable.  Ridiculously I find 18 degrees central heating too stifling.

The difficulty of energy usage is that it is personal, even with my knowledge the only way to really 'help' someone is to go to the property and go through room by room what is in it.  Then it is behaviour of use.

I can only do this for myself and my partner, it becomes impossible for people you don't live with.  They like to keep things plugged in or on for no reason/their reason and will leave TVs/lights on when they aren't in the room.  It takes discipline and - currently - having to give things up.

You can control your/partners consumption but the adult children are very difficult, this is where the black hole will be.

From what you have written your problem is a ball of knotted string, you can unpick it eventually and you will get there but it will take a lot of time and work and no one can really help you.

Thank you - I found your post thought provoking. Yes, the black hole is indeed with the adult children, mainly my son. He does use a lot of tech for his current business activities - he is an entrepreneur, albeit not a very rich one, so I am trying to support him as he grows his business in the hope that one day he may be able to buy a house of his own. In the meantime I have TP monitors on all his devices to ensure that he contributes appropriately for his use. Without doubt he is the biggest consumer in the house...

I'm in the same place as you @MariaAH, with adult children and its been process of gradual dawning on them that I am not joking when I say you a) pay for all the tech energy you use with real, actual money b) you get rid of the PCs or c) You move out. It was all a bit of an 'eye rolling' joke with them at first - but I have reiterated the choices as starkly as I could  - patiently at first but with increasing insistency - links in the family WhapsApp group to key news items about the energy crisis; post-it notes on domestic appliances and next to light switches. We have a large blackboard in the kitchen for family notices and reminders - using most of the space on it I have spelt it out in real financial terms just how much they are costing me and that there is no Plan B - they cough up, use less or get out and I don't actually have a choice.  It's been difficult for all of us to accept this shift in financial responsibility - we all tend to treat even our grown-up kids as kids! It's definitely still a 'family work in progress' but gradually I am seeing a shift. 
Fortunately, I am the only one who knows how to use our central heating controls and I have worked out I can slip the plastic dial cover off the thermostat and jam the cover flap for the timer shut - which renders it useless to the untrained 

Alnat1

If you keep all the internal doors closed, the hall, which is only a passageway not somewhere you spend time, doesn't need to be heated much (TRV on 1?) so there's not much heat to escape when the front door is opened.

At least, that is my plan for this coming winter but in reality, without fitting self-closers on the doors I can't see it working very well. And the cat is going to be annoyed when he keeps getting "trapped" in a room.

MariaAH

TheGardener said:

I'm in the same place as you @MariaAH, with adult children and its been process of gradual dawning on them that I am not joking when I say you a) pay for all the tech energy you use with real, actual money b) you get rid of the PCs or c) You move out. It was all a bit of an 'eye rolling' joke with them at first - but I have reiterated the choices as starkly as I could  - patiently at first but with increasing insistency - links in the family WhapsApp group to key news items about the energy crisis; post-it notes on domestic appliances and next to light switches. We have a large blackboard in the kitchen for family notices and reminders - using most of the space on it I have spelt it out in real financial terms just how much they are costing me and that there is no Plan B - they cough up, use less or get out and I don't actually have a choice.  It's been difficult for all of us to accept this shift in financial responsibility - we all tend to treat even our grown-up kids as kids! It's definitely still a 'family work in progress' but gradually I am seeing a shift. 
Fortunately, I am the only one who knows how to use our central heating controls and I have worked out I can slip the plastic dial cover off the thermostat and jam the cover flap for the timer shut - which renders it useless to the untrained 

A lot of parity between your experience and mine! I am sending key news items to them too and involving them in the discussion...thankfully we have progressed past the responses of "why don't you just change supplier then" or "why don't you go on an EV tariff then" or "just get solar panels then".

We are making progress. My daughter even remembered to turn the oven off at wall after making an omelette and has significantly cut down on shower time. My son gets it, and has stopped going on about solar panels (I don't know where he thinks the money comes from to pay for that!). I have made it clear that he must pay for what he uses and he has accepted that the TP monitors are there to stay on his devices. He charges his car once or twice a month at most, and I can monitor that usage too. We did consider motion sensor lights, but will that cost in? 

Good initiative re the heating controls!

MariaAH

Alnat1 said:

If you keep all the internal doors closed, the hall, which is only a passageway not somewhere you spend time, doesn't need to be heated much (TRV on 1?) so there's not much heat to escape when the front door is opened.

At least, that is my plan for this coming winter but in reality, without fitting self-closers on the doors I can't see it working very well. And the cat is going to be annoyed when he keeps getting "trapped" in a room.

Funny, I was just thinking same thing about our cat! 

Alnat1

Our female tortoise laid eggs for the first time this summer, the (grown-up, moved out) kids made me try and hatch them. Now have 1 teeny new hatchling to keep warm under a 80w heat lamp all day over winter.  At least the 2 adult torties will be hibernating (in the fridge).......pets are NOT very energy efficient!

70sbudgie

MariaAH said:

My son gets it, and has stopped going on about solar panels (I don't know where he thinks the money comes from to pay for that!). I have made it clear that he must pay for what he uses and he has accepted that the TP monitors are there to stay on his devices. He charges his car once or twice a month at most, and I can monitor that usage too. 

Could you give your son a "project" to research the purchase of solar panels? And present a fully costed business case? (It's a good skill for a budding entrenpreneur to have) Perhaps then he will realise that they aren't necessarily the magic answer. Or offer to pay for them for you!?

I know you said that your smart meter is behaving dumb, but what make/model is it? Some of the SMETS 1 meters can more easily be "converted" to SMETS 2 than others. (For example mine is a Secure meter.) It may be that BG don't want to bother with sorting yours because it won't count against their targets. What reason did they give for you not being eligible for a smart meter?

70sbudgie

i have to say that the response of your adult children terrifies me! My children are still very young, so I have different challenges but they seem almost negligible compared to those of adult children!

Effecting behaviour change is one of the biggest challenges.

MariaAH

70sbudgie said:

MariaAH said:

My son gets it, and has stopped going on about solar panels (I don't know where he thinks the money comes from to pay for that!). I have made it clear that he must pay for what he uses and he has accepted that the TP monitors are there to stay on his devices. He charges his car once or twice a month at most, and I can monitor that usage too. 

Could you give your son a "project" to research the purchase of solar panels? And present a fully costed business case? (It's a good skill for a budding entrenpreneur to have) Perhaps then he will realise that they aren't necessarily the magic answer. Or offer to pay for them for you!?

I know you said that your smart meter is behaving dumb, but what make/model is it? Some of the SMETS 1 meters can more easily be "converted" to SMETS 2 than others. (For example mine is a Secure meter.) It may be that BG don't want to bother with sorting yours because it won't count against their targets. What reason did they give for you not being eligible for a smart meter?

Funnily enough I already tried setting him a target to cost up solar panels, in the hope he would realise the expense in terms of initial outlay...he costed up Tesla solar panels and powerwall battery and said it was 'only' about £12K...So that was a bit of a fail!

I think we chucked the old smart meter as it was useless and thought at the time BG would give us one. Up until recently the automated response to our request for one was that we were not suitable, and more recently that there is a supply issue. Not helpful.

RobM99

Gasp! A BIG read, this thread but can someone explain - how does a gaming PC use so much electricity when a laptop uses so little? It must produce enough heat to keep the house warm on its own (obviously not!). Puzzled.

Krakkkers

Graphics cards are like room heaters.