Oct price cap increase likely to push energy bill to over £10k... for a family of 4...

MariaAH

70sbudgie said:

Wow this thread is interesting. I had to read to the end!

Things I have discovered on my energy saving journey:
Shower heads with flow limiters - uses vacuum theory and air to make it feel more powerful, but reduces water consumption and heating energy.

We have those too - and surprisingly barely notice the difference in the shower than flow is reduced

My Renault Zoe (new in early 2019) has an eco mode and default of AC on. Turning off AC (but not heating/ air) and using eco mode makes a HUGE difference to its energy consumption.

My 2021 Zoe has a convenient button to put ECO mode on or off. By default it is on, but turn off on motorway if traffic flowing above 65 mph...I find up until that speed ECO does just fine. You can literally see on the energy dial how inefficient it is without ECO mode off.

Targetting baseload makes a big difference because of the cumulative effect over 24hrs. (From a previous post, it sounds like you have a baseload of ~500A @MariaAH . The way to find this is to go round the house after everyone else has gone to bed and see what you can turn off, including things that don't need to be on standby. Though checking the bedrooms of adult children may be an issue) I am a fiend for switching things off at the wall.

This one of my issues...adult children (19 and 22) who go to bed after us. We can go to bed having turned lights and TV off, but come down in the morning to find lights on in the kitchen, hallway and lounge.

Base load is the main issue and am gradually working my way round the house monitoring use. We have a 'TV corner' in the lounge (TV, sound bar, sky box, playstation, router) that has a standby of 64W all together...am in negotiations with husband about what can be turned off. Some devices have a spike when you power them up, negating the benefits of turning them off rather than on standby. Things like the sky box and router would be an absolute pain to turn of (we have numerous issues with sky box as it is!). I tried turning my printer off rather standby. Took me ages to get it to connect back via WiFi to the iMac so won't be doing that again in a hurry!

Energy usage in son's bedroom is a minefield but I am monitoring Gaming PC, 2 x monitors and an aircon unit. He has another power strip with numerous chargers plugged in with nothing on the end...need more TP monitors. 

After reducing consumption on lots of things, I realised I could tell when we had a movie night. 

And that is where I want to get to!

Krakkkers

As i said yesterday, i can tell if a 10w bulb is on.

C225

Do you leave either of the EV's plugged in constantly even when not charging?  Not sure of the Zoe's but certainly my Tesla will happily use a constant 300w to keep it's computer powered on when not fully asleep.

Halo572

I haven't read all 41 pages of this, but it would seem to be down to a usage behaviour issue.

And I don't mean a helpful politician/helpful forum poster - reduce your usage comment, more the attitude of probably your sons.

I have a masters in Environmental Management and have been doing my own personal energy management for the past 20 years, my current Summer bill is around £60 for just me, last year it was £35.

Last Winter I was controlling the bills to £120 a month and that was with an average room temperature I wasn't in of 12 degrees.

I do have to consider my wide collection of house plants but they manged OK.

I don't know what I will do if they do not reverse the October price cap, other than pay another £80 a month for 12 degrees.

I am at the point to save I will need to stop using lights, using the TV, cooking, washing clothes, washing up and all the other everyday things that before April were normal throughout history, which is why anyone who says 'reduce' is ill informed and ignorant.  Looking at you daily standing charge.

Like others I can tell what I have used during the day - washing machine, dishwasher, desk fan, TV that puts the meter up more than 'normal'.  I can give you an approximate cost of using them as well.

You definitely need a meter, although you can (could) buy a wireless electricity monitor that connects to the mains inlet cable.  it measures the charge coming into the house through the main cable and works just like a smart meter.  I used this for years until I got a smart meter.

Thermometers in each room also help me, you may need to turn your thermostat down and live in a colder house, I aim for 16 in the rooms I am in and I find that bearable.  Ridiculously I find 18 degrees central heating too stifling.

The difficulty of energy usage is that it is personal, even with my knowledge the only way to really 'help' someone is to go to the property and go through room by room what is in it.  Then it is behaviour of use.

I can only do this for myself and my partner, it becomes impossible for people you don't live with.  They like to keep things plugged in or on for no reason/their reason and will leave TVs/lights on when they aren't in the room.  It takes discipline and - currently - having to give things up.

You can control your/partners consumption but the adult children are very difficult, this is where the black hole will be.

From what you have written your problem is a ball of knotted string, you can unpick it eventually and you will get there but it will take a lot of time and work and no one can really help you.

MariaAH

C225 said:

Do you leave either of the EV's plugged in constantly even when not charging?  Not sure of the Zoe's but certainly my Tesla will happily use a constant 300w to keep it's computer powered on when not fully asleep.

No we have an app to monitor charging and would unplug when it reaches anywhere between 80% and 100% - I have read that you should only charge to 80% as more inefficient after that? Can anyone confirm? Interesting re the Tesla...my husband had a company Tesla for a couple of months just before his redundancy...

One thing that is becoming apparent is that the information available to consumers about the amount of energy consumed when charging is lacking transparency...

C225

MariaAH said:

C225 said:

Do you leave either of the EV's plugged in constantly even when not charging?  Not sure of the Zoe's but certainly my Tesla will happily use a constant 300w to keep it's computer powered on when not fully asleep.

No we have an app to monitor charging and would unplug when it reaches anywhere between 80% and 100% - I have read that you should only charge to 80% as more inefficient after that? Can anyone confirm? Interesting re the Tesla...my husband had a company Tesla for a couple of months just before his redundancy...

One thing that is becoming apparent is that the information available to consumers about the amount of energy consumed when charging is lacking transparency...

On a public rapid charger it will slow down the fuller the battery gets so it's best etiquette to leave between 80-90% also depending on the battery chemistry it is not a good thing to leave them at high states of charge as it will degrade the capacity longer term.

Their are inefficiency's in charging an EV at home due to the onboard chargers converting the AC input into DC the battery can use to charge. I'm sure i read somewhere it was around 8%. ie you actuallly use 8% more power than the battery goes up.  Certainly from last night my App said i had added 25kWh to the car but the smart meter read i had used 28kWh.

MariaAH

Halo572 said:

I haven't read all 41 pages of this, but it would seem to be down to a usage behaviour issue.

And I don't mean a helpful politician/helpful forum poster - reduce your usage comment, more the attitude of probably your sons.

I have a masters in Environmental Management and have been doing my own personal energy management for the past 20 years, my current Summer bill is around £60 for just me, last year it was £35.

Last Winter I was controlling the bills to £120 a month and that was with an average room temperature I wasn't in of 12 degrees.

I do have to consider my wide collection of house plants but they manged OK.

I don't know what I will do if they do not reverse the October price cap, other than pay another £80 a month for 12 degrees.

I am at the point to save I will need to stop using lights, using the TV, cooking, washing clothes, washing up and all the other everyday things that before April were normal throughout history, which is why anyone who says 'reduce' is ill informed and ignorant.  Looking at you daily standing charge.

Like others I can tell what I have used during the day - washing machine, dishwasher, desk fan, TV that puts the meter up more than 'normal'.  I can give you an approximate cost of using them as well.

You definitely need a meter, although you can (could) buy a wireless electricity monitor that connects to the mains inlet cable.  it measures the charge coming into the house through the main cable and works just like a smart meter.  I used this for years until I got a smart meter.

Thermometers in each room also help me, you may need to turn your thermostat down and live in a colder house, I aim for 16 in the rooms I am in and I find that bearable.  Ridiculously I find 18 degrees central heating too stifling.

The difficulty of energy usage is that it is personal, even with my knowledge the only way to really 'help' someone is to go to the property and go through room by room what is in it.  Then it is behaviour of use.

I can only do this for myself and my partner, it becomes impossible for people you don't live with.  They like to keep things plugged in or on for no reason/their reason and will leave TVs/lights on when they aren't in the room.  It takes discipline and - currently - having to give things up.

You can control your/partners consumption but the adult children are very difficult, this is where the black hole will be.

From what you have written your problem is a ball of knotted string, you can unpick it eventually and you will get there but it will take a lot of time and work and no one can really help you.

Thank you - I found your post thought provoking. Yes, the black hole is indeed with the adult children, mainly my son. He does use a lot of tech for his current business activities - he is an entrepreneur, albeit not a very rich one, so I am trying to support him as he grows his business in the hope that one day he may be able to buy a house of his own. In the meantime I have TP monitors on all his devices to ensure that he contributes appropriately for his use. Without doubt he is the biggest consumer in the house. 

The heating will be our target this winter - I have read Martin Lewis' "heat the human not the home" - thermostat will be significantly turned down from previous years.

ADVICE NEEDED: Our front door opens directly into hallway (i.e. no porch) and we have a kitchen door that opens direct into the garden. How do we limit warm air escaping when the door is open? Have been looking at Thermal Curtains? Anyone else tried this?

Krakkkers

You need an airlock and a pressure suit.

Sea_Shell

On the door issue, I'm not sure there is much you can do about it.   (Ours is the same)

Any sort of curtain is fine for insulating a closed door, but would be a PITA to wrestle with each time you use the door.   Especially if it's inward opening.

The late night kids probably wouldn't close it either!!

You just have to be quick...and avoid chatting with any callers/deliveries etc.

Or if you're not expecting anyone... don't open the door!!!!   It'll be Trick or Treat season soon😉... IGNORE 🤣

deano2099

MariaAH said:

This one of my issues...adult children (19 and 22) who go to bed after us. We can go to bed having turned lights and TV off, but come down in the morning to find lights on in the kitchen, hallway and lounge.

You can get bulbs that have built in motion and light sensors, they're fairly cheap (about 10 quid) and we use them in hallways rather than regular light switches, so there is no forgetting to turn them off. I'm not sure if the drain from the sensor is worth the saving though, never measured it, we did it for convenience.

You can go deep into smart home stuff starting with those smart sockets. So a smart bulb in the children's bedrooms and when the last of those lights is turned off, all the other lights and all the smart sockets turn off... it's doable, and if you're otherwise interested in smart home solutions is a value-add, but it really should be a lot cheaper to just change your kids' behaviour! But if that absolutely can't work, there are options...