Opposition proposals to freeze the price cap - fair for people who have fixed?

jimexbox

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

What if you don't want to pay it back over 15 years. What about those who live with their parents, who will pay the surcharge if they move out, as well as their parents? 

One of the daftest ideas I've read so far. 

[Deleted User]

bristolleedsfan said:

[Deleted User] said:

The ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

Trying to minimise additional customer bad debts ....

And, in my view, sensibly getting the taxpayer off the hook. It also offers consumers 2 years of price certainty. The idea was first proposed AFAIK by the CEO of Octopus earlier this year. He sent out an email to Octopus customers seeking feedback on the proposal.

sienew

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

Taking a "long term mortgage" or debt to pay off day to day living expenses is, and always has been, considered by almost everyone to be a terrible way to live and is the very worst form of debt. Usually long term debt is only taken out for investments that'll pay for themselves many times over (houses for most people).

[Deleted User]

jimexbox said:

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

What if you don't want to pay it back over 15 years. What about those who live with their parents, who will pay the surcharge if they move out, as well as their parents? 

One of the daftest ideas I've read so far. 

It is not an individual loan. It is a scheme whereby suppliers can claim for the difference in energy costs. When wholesale prices fall, the reduction will not be passed onto consumers. It will be used to repay the lenders of the loan.

NO ONE could ever devise a scheme which is 100% fair on everybody. There will always be winners and losers. The two main advantages of this scheme is that taxpayers do not have to find £Bns and those who use the most energy will pay back more of the loan.

In your scenario, when children move out then energy usage falls. 

Max68

Whatever way you look at it people are going to be in debt, either short term or long term.  I don't know what the answer is but having people have to come up with £300-£400 a month or more to pay an energy bill is impossible for many.

jimexbox

[Deleted User] said:

jimexbox said:

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

What if you don't want to pay it back over 15 years. What about those who live with their parents, who will pay the surcharge if they move out, as well as their parents? 

One of the daftest ideas I've read so far. 

It is not an individual loan. It is a scheme whereby suppliers can claim for the difference in energy costs. When wholesale prices fall, the reduction will not be passed onto consumers. It will be used to repay the lenders of the loan.

NO ONE could ever devise a scheme which is 100% fair on everybody. There will always be winners and losers. The two main advantages of this scheme is that taxpayers do not have to find £Bns and those who use the most energy will pay back more of the loan.

In your scenario, when children move out then energy usage falls. 

I know exactly what the proposal is, obviously it's not personal loan. I would still incur part of a debt that I would be forced to pay, even if I wanted no part of this shared debt.

Incurring personal debt should be a  choice. Unless of course you want to live in a socialist state, where you are controlled from birth. No thanks. 

savers_united

sienew said:

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

Taking a "long term mortgage" or debt to pay off day to day living expenses is, and always has been, considered by almost everyone to be a terrible way to live and is the very worst form of debt. Usually long term debt is only taken out for investments that'll pay for themselves many times over (houses for most people).

Whilst I agree and something I would not consider doing myself, people are going to find themselves in a difficult place with energy costs and so alot will turn to loans, credit cards etc to see them through.

Still need to see the details, but with 2 big players in the domestic energy market now backing the idea I guess something along these lines will eventually get the green light. 

Mstty

The one big shortfall for us, that we have discussed, is that with such a scheme there isn't enough time of hardship to force people to value their energy use and cut down.

We don't like the idea of buy now pay later on a long term mortgage loan type scheme either as that's not how we run our household.

Lastly I can't see this being adopted by the Tories and if it is then it will need diluting a bit, re branded and washed to come out as an original idea. In Liz we fuss.

If I were a betting person I would say £100 a month from October with something similar to this for April 2023 price cap which don't forget is estimated to be £4427. That's the Biggie 

[Deleted User]

jimexbox said:

[Deleted User] said:

jimexbox said:

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

What if you don't want to pay it back over 15 years. What about those who live with their parents, who will pay the surcharge if they move out, as well as their parents? 

One of the daftest ideas I've read so far. 

It is not an individual loan. It is a scheme whereby suppliers can claim for the difference in energy costs. When wholesale prices fall, the reduction will not be passed onto consumers. It will be used to repay the lenders of the loan.

NO ONE could ever devise a scheme which is 100% fair on everybody. There will always be winners and losers. The two main advantages of this scheme is that taxpayers do not have to find £Bns and those who use the most energy will pay back more of the loan.

In your scenario, when children move out then energy usage falls. 

I know exactly what the proposal is, obviously it's not personal loan. I would still incur part of a debt that I would be forced to pay, even if I wanted no part of this shared debt.

Incurring personal debt should be a  choice. Unless of course you want to live in a socialist state, where you are controlled from birth. No thanks. 

I would be interested to know what you would do to help people through this very difficult period that doesn’t involve some form of financial help which has to be paid back through energy bills or through taxes? 

savers_united

jimexbox said:

[Deleted User] said:

A ‘plan’ is gaining momentum:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/15/centrica-and-octopus-back-plan-to-freeze-uk-energy-bills-for-two-years

Think of it as taking out a long-term mortgage to pay off our high energy bills over the short term.

What if you don't want to pay it back over 15 years. What about those who live with their parents, who will pay the surcharge if they move out, as well as their parents? 

One of the daftest ideas I've read so far. 

Those children will benefit from alot of the green energy that they will have not contributed to, just like alot of us have benefited from Nuclear plants that we never contributed to, and on it goes. How about the CT rebate or the £400 energy grant, if you don't qualify at the time then you lose out.

Winners and losers, there has to be a cut off, someone moving into a home or back with Mam and Dad will not get to pay it.

But let's wait and see what is announced and the detail before we assume to much.