Landlord didn't protect deposit and now there's a dispute brewing

macman

No, because it has to be done within 30 days of receipt. Too late now. 
As has been repeatedly said, there is no defence and you will win in court. If she lives in Spain she will not return to defend it anyway, so just ask for return and you will get it.

anselld

macman said:

No, because it has to be done within 30 days of receipt. Too late now. 
As has been repeatedly said, there is no defence and you will win in court. If she lives in Spain she will not return to defend it anyway, so just ask for return and you will get it.

If she does live in Spain it is going to complicate the Court and/or enforcement process though.  Winning is one thing, actually getting your hands on the money is another, at least in the short term.

gingercordial

Baer1982 said:

RAS said:

If your deposit was protected, you'd have been sleeping.

Agree @RAS - there's many a slip 'twixt being entitled to a full refund and actually seeing the money I guess. 

Take the loose door; that should have been repaired before it was even rented to you.

I feel so too, and this is what I'd have done in her place. But as this loose door isn't in the moving in inventory, she could claim that we were to blame for taking this all the way from perfect condition to hanging loose. Anyways, as you said before, I guess it doesn't matter what the inventory said for the landlord's liability to protect the deposit. 

One thing that just occurred to me: 

While I've checked all 3 deposit protection companies and couldn't find my deposit, is it possible she's legitimately protected it elsewhere and I just don't know? 

I also saw the LL is obligated to send some mandatory/prescribed information about where and how the deposit is protected, so I guess she's at fault at least for not informing me, though I'd imagine the penalties for this would be smaller. 

No - actually the less detailed moving in inventory is in your favour because the landlord has to prove the initial condition of everything in order to establish you "broke" it.  Did the moving in inventory happen to include a photograph/description of this hinge, stating it was in perfect condition?

If no -> there is nothing to prove it wasn't already broken when you moved in, therefore deterioration cannot be proved
If yes -> you would argue fair wear and tear anyway (or in fact that the next tenant could have damaged it, as the moving out inventory was not done at the correct time)

You're in a very strong position overall - she just hasn't realised it yet.

Philomel

Even if she had protected the deposit, the fact that other people had access to the property between you moving out and the checkout inventory taking place would make that inventory worthless (because the damage could have been done after you left). But the fact that she hasn't protected the deposit is absolutely the major thing. Ask for it all back. Don't let her make any deductions. I had a landlord who wanted to deduct for a bunch of stupid minor things and as soon as we raised the fact that the deposit wasn't protected we had the full deposit returned immediately and a grovelling apology 😂 if she doesn't know yet that it's a big deal she will be able to find out very quickly

sidneyvic

RAS said:

Stop going on about the repairs.

They are irrelevant.

Send a letter before action to the LL. Send a physical copy to the address for the serving of notices, and email to the LL as well.

Dear LL

Further to our recent discussion regarding the deposit, it appears that you failed to protect this in line with the legal requirements. 

I refer to Liaw v Sohal.

If the full deposit is not returned  to my/our account by (date), we will commence legal action to claim the deposit plus penalty (up to 3 times the deposit).

Baer1982

Exactly this, do not enter any discussions regarding deductions, get your deposit back in full and tell her to go sing for any deductions. Just remember she was perfectly willing to try and rob you even after the years you have paid rent. Go for jugular....

Baer1982

gingercordial said:

No - actually the less detailed moving in inventory is in your favour because the landlord has to prove the initial condition of everything in order to establish you "broke" it.  Did the moving in inventory happen to include a photograph/description of this hinge, stating it was in perfect condition?

If no -> there is nothing to prove it wasn't already broken when you moved in, therefore deterioration cannot be proved
If yes -> you would argue fair wear and tear anyway (or in fact that the next tenant could have damaged it, as the moving out inventory was not done at the correct time)

You're in a very strong position overall - she just hasn't realised it yet.

@gingercordial       That's a very pleasant surprise. 

This feels so different from other similar practices (e.g. when you hire a rental car for instance, unless you note the pre-existing damage on the check-out sheet, it's a given that any dents or scrapes on return will be deemed to be the renter's responsibility), but definitely not looking a gift horse in the mouth!

Baer1982

anselld said:

If she does live in Spain it is going to complicate the Court and/or enforcement process though.  Winning is one thing, actually getting your hands on the money is another, at least in the short term.

Indeed. Hope the letter works, and she agrees to refund without going to court etc. Least hassle for both, though she may feel she lost whatever repairs she thought she was entitled to. 

brianposter

macman said:

What sort of LL lives in Spain and does not have any maintenance or emergency repair contract in place?

Me. There is not much point in having a maintenance company that is 60 miles from the property.

In reality there needs to be a separate sort of tenancy for some absentee landlords.

Titus_Wadd

OP promise me that you will never mention repairs and deductions again, if you find yourself typing these words in an email, delete them and rewrite it tomorrow.  Ask only for the deposit and explain why she should return it in full (or x 2 or 3 if you're feeling assertive).

If she telephones you don't answer, everything in writing gives you a paper-trail to refer back to. 

You have been gas-lighted by this woman and you should be furious that perhaps your flat wasn't safe as no mandatory safety checks were documented let alone done.  You are not being mean to her or causing her to be disappointed that some walls won't get painted, she doesn't deserve a second thought.

Now.  Where you live now, if it's rented, double-check everything now, that all the checks have been done, that you have been supplied with all the relevant paper work.  If you can't do it for you, do it for me.

Then, depending on whether you can be bothered, pass on this info to the poor s0d who moved in after you left, so that they can be forewarned and forearmed. 

It makes me so angry to read about slip-shod service in any walk of life, but landlords are regulated for a reason and people playing at being a landlord, like yours, give law-abiding business people a bad name!

macman

anselld said:

macman said:

No, because it has to be done within 30 days of receipt. Too late now. 
As has been repeatedly said, there is no defence and you will win in court. If she lives in Spain she will not return to defend it anyway, so just ask for return and you will get it.

If she does live in Spain it is going to complicate the Court and/or enforcement process though.  Winning is one thing, actually getting your hands on the money is another, at least in the short term.

No problem getting it to court: the OP would win by default in her absence. But there will be no need to enforce it. Once the LL is issued with an LBA and realises that she cannot defend the non-protection claim, then she should refund the full deposit, unless she is completely clueless (which, given the evidence so far, is more than likely).