Popla appeal following parking in disabled bay PREMIER PARK pcn

rosya

Appeal to premier park rejected.
Daughter parked in disabled bay, she had a baby coughing and choking and needed to park up asap, no parent and child spaces available so used the disabled bay to be able to swing door open wide to access baby.
Space was in front of a shop in retail park, she subsequently went in to find somewhere to change the baby. Stayed approx 10…15 mins. 
She admitted parking in disabled bay, however, no parent and child bays are provided at this car park.
Fast forward 3 weeks from PCN and Premier park have now agreed to only issue fines  on football match days. Is it possible for a successful appeal to POPLA on the grounds that they have agreed to end unfair parking restrictions and the day in question was not a match day and hence would not have warranted a ticket for using a disabled bay?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Fruitcake

It is not a fine.

What happened when your daughter asked the landowner/retail park management company to cancel? That is always Plan A.

The blue badge scheme does not apply on private land, so lawfully, anyone can use them. Morally though, they should only be used if an occupant of the car has a disability and protected characteristics in accordance with the Equality Act 2010.
Parent and child bays are nothing but a gimmick, and the fact that none were available does mean someone without a disability as above should use an accessible bay instead.

Having said that, stopping to attend to a choking child anywhere, including an accessible parking bay is fair enough, and nobody can be criticised for doing so. However, as soon as the emergency was over the driver should have found somewhere else to park, even if it meant leaving site.
I would imagine however that the driver was frightened and concerned for the baby's safety, and unwilling to spend time looking for another space whilst leaving a vulnerable child unattended in case it choked again, and would instead want to take the baby to a safe place to check it over and attend to its needs, both medical and physical.

Let's hope the landowner etcetera has some compassion.

The change of terms for only issuing charges on match days should be included in a PoPLA appeal, but not as a stand alone point. PoPLA will not consider mitigating circumstances. Use all the points available from the third post of the NEWBIES sticky Announcement, but not until Plan A has been exhausted.

Show us the draft appeal before submitting it.

rosya

Fruitcake said:

It is not a fine.

What happened when your daughter asked the landowner/retail park management company to cancel? That is always Plan A.

The blue badge scheme does not apply on private land, so lawfully, anyone can use them. Morally though, they should only be used if an occupant of the car has a disability and protected characteristics in accordance with the Equality Act 2010.
Parent and child bays are nothing but a gimmick, and the fact that none were available does mean someone without a disability as above should use an accessible bay instead.

Having said that, stopping to attend to a choking child anywhere, including an accessible parking bay is fair enough, and nobody can be criticised for doing so. However, as soon as the emergency was over the driver should have found somewhere else to park, even if it meant leaving site.
I would imagine however that the driver was frightened and concerned for the baby's safety, and unwilling to spend time looking for another space whilst leaving a vulnerable child unattended in case it choked again, and would instead want to take the baby to a safe place to check it over and attend to its needs, both medical and physical.

Let's hope the landowner etcetera has some compassion.

The change of terms for only issuing charges on match days should be included in a PoPLA appeal, but not as a stand alone point. PoPLA will not consider mitigating circumstances. Use all the points available from the third post of the NEWBIES sticky Announcement, but not until Plan A has been exhausted.

Show us the draft appeal before submitting it.

Thank you for your quick response. She did not contact the retail park management and assumed because of the circumstances the pcn appeal would be accepted. 

The signage states that disabled spaces are for blue badge holders only and no concessions apply. If they are not lawful then can be this used for the appeal to PoPLA, she did not exceed time limit so the offence was to use a disabled space.

Umkomaas

rosya said:

Fruitcake said:

It is not a fine.

What happened when your daughter asked the landowner/retail park management company to cancel? That is always Plan A.

The blue badge scheme does not apply on private land, so lawfully, anyone can use them. Morally though, they should only be used if an occupant of the car has a disability and protected characteristics in accordance with the Equality Act 2010.
Parent and child bays are nothing but a gimmick, and the fact that none were available does mean someone without a disability as above should use an accessible bay instead.

Having said that, stopping to attend to a choking child anywhere, including an accessible parking bay is fair enough, and nobody can be criticised for doing so. However, as soon as the emergency was over the driver should have found somewhere else to park, even if it meant leaving site.
I would imagine however that the driver was frightened and concerned for the baby's safety, and unwilling to spend time looking for another space whilst leaving a vulnerable child unattended in case it choked again, and would instead want to take the baby to a safe place to check it over and attend to its needs, both medical and physical.

Let's hope the landowner etcetera has some compassion.

The change of terms for only issuing charges on match days should be included in a PoPLA appeal, but not as a stand alone point. PoPLA will not consider mitigating circumstances. Use all the points available from the third post of the NEWBIES sticky Announcement, but not until Plan A has been exhausted.

Show us the draft appeal before submitting it.

Thank you for your quick response. She did not contact the retail park management and assumed because of the circumstances the pcn appeal would be accepted. 

The signage states that disabled spaces are for blue badge holders only and no concessions apply. If they are not lawful then can be this used for the appeal to PoPLA, she did not exceed time limit so the offence was to use a disabled space.

A very difficult case to win at POPLA, so your best bet is with the retail park's Managing Agent - someone like Jones Lang LaSalle, or Savills (very helpful and empathetic), or Workman, or Ashdown Phillips ... and others. Check the totem pole sign at the retail park opening, that often shows the name of the MA at the bottom. 

Which retail park is this, we may have seen and dealt with cases there previously? 

Fruitcake

rosya said:

Fruitcake said:

It is not a fine.

What happened when your daughter asked the landowner/retail park management company to cancel? That is always Plan A.

The blue badge scheme does not apply on private land, so lawfully, anyone can use them. Morally though, they should only be used if an occupant of the car has a disability and protected characteristics in accordance with the Equality Act 2010.
Parent and child bays are nothing but a gimmick, and the fact that none were available does mean someone without a disability as above should use an accessible bay instead.

Having said that, stopping to attend to a choking child anywhere, including an accessible parking bay is fair enough, and nobody can be criticised for doing so. However, as soon as the emergency was over the driver should have found somewhere else to park, even if it meant leaving site.
I would imagine however that the driver was frightened and concerned for the baby's safety, and unwilling to spend time looking for another space whilst leaving a vulnerable child unattended in case it choked again, and would instead want to take the baby to a safe place to check it over and attend to its needs, both medical and physical.

Let's hope the landowner etcetera has some compassion.

The change of terms for only issuing charges on match days should be included in a PoPLA appeal, but not as a stand alone point. PoPLA will not consider mitigating circumstances. Use all the points available from the third post of the NEWBIES sticky Announcement, but not until Plan A has been exhausted.

Show us the draft appeal before submitting it.

Thank you for your quick response. She did not contact the retail park management and assumed because of the circumstances the pcn appeal would be accepted. 

The signage states that disabled spaces are for blue badge holders only and no concessions apply. If they are not lawful then can be this used for the appeal to PoPLA, she did not exceed time limit so the offence was to use a disabled space.

The whole parking industry refuses to accept anything other than a blue badge to indicate a disability. In your daughter's case however, the parking contract is formed by the signs in the car park, so the PPC and PoPLA will not budge regarding failure to display a blue badge in an accessible bay.
Even if the allow for the initial emergency, I doubt they will accept not moving the car afterwards.

Plan A is her best bet.

rosya

Thank you for all your help. 

I will contact the management agency which is Savills UK, the car park in question is Plas Coch retail park, Wrexham. 

fisherjim

rosya said:

The signage states that disabled spaces are for blue badge holders only and no concessions apply. If they are not lawful then can be this used for the appeal to PoPLA, she did not exceed time limit so the offence was to use a disabled space.

I think you are getting a bit confused, no one has said "they are not lawful" as such.

The whole idea is that a disabled badge can be used as an easy way to help the PPCs attendant determine if the vehicle has the right under their T&C's to park in a disabled spot. In a fair scheme an appeal to the PPC with mitigating circumstances should get the charge cancelled.

But PPC's are not fair they are only greedy, and POPLA only consider process not mitigation.

The PPCs thus use contract law to argue; our rules, conform or else. POPLA will agree unless there is a loophole in the signage.

Umkomaas

rosya said:

Thank you for all your help. 

I will contact the management agency which is Savills UK, the car park in question is Plas Coch retail park, Wrexham. 

Fairly new nuisance on the retail park. Savills will hopefully help you. Emphasis the panic your daughter was in with a choking baby in the back seat. 

https://www.leaderlive.co.uk/news/20233149.wrexham-disgraceful-parking-fines-retail-park-slammed/

Seems there has been a change to the scam arrangements!

https://www.leaderlive.co.uk/news/20299003.wrexham-change-controversial-parking-regulations-retail-park/

Obviously a problem only on match days - I bet Premier will be spitting feathers at the reduction in potential income, down to one day a fortnight, where beforehand it was 7 days a week. 

That's what Hollywood film stars bring - parking problems where the current infrastructure isn't capable of coping with surging demand. Maybe Ryan and Rob should build a big match day multi-story!

KeithP

rosya said:

Thank you for all your help. 

I will contact the management agency which is Savills UK, the car park in question is Plas Coch retail park, Wrexham. 

A recent newspaper article was brought to our attention by @Mouse007 a few days ago...
forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/79292742/#Comment_79292742

Coupon-mad

This looks unwinnable at POPLA.

And the fact she went inside to change the baby's nappy and left the car parked in an accessible bay means I'm out of this one and will simply say that I hope she knows never to do this again (and I genuinely hope Savills cancel it...).

My only extra comment is about the legalities and that we can't condone this sort of parking.  Not having so-called 'parent & child' bays never means people with young kids can park in a disabled bay, certainly not leaving the car there.

Disabled bays have a legal reason under the Equality Act 2010.  Parent & Child bays are a shopping gimmick. Chalk and cheese.

And the car park owners/shops will still have a legal obligation to disabled people to police those bays themselves.

rosya

Thank you again for the additional comments.  My daughter is a single parent with a young baby and now with all the extra costs with price increases energy, food etc she said she cannot pay the fine if it is applicable and will have to ignore the latest pcn. Will she be taken to court if the management company refuse to assist?