British Gas doubled direct debit!

peter3hg

k_man said:

peter3hg said:

k_man said:

pochase said:

wild666 said:

4.4 kWh per day is only 1606 kWh per year about £450 plus around £180 SC. You will be paying most of your yearly usage with one months DD if that is your true usage.
If BG say they can read the meter then if your usage is correct at no more than 4.4 kWh per day then BG are trying it on as £549 per month with no debt on the account is just short of £6,600 per year.

How do you get to 4.4KWh per day if an immersion heater is running 3 hours per day? That is already 9KWh.

The OP said he used 6499KWh since November 2021 (8 months), 800KWh per month in average.

Does that assume it is actually heating for the whole 3 hours?

If the tank is well insulated, it won't make much of a difference how long the immersion is on, even if 24/7 (unless it's faulty).

45 mins of heating the hot water is about enough in our house. Even though the heating is timed for 90 mins, it only actually heats for 45, because after 45 mins, the tank is full of hot water.

Unless the hot water being available changes shower habits!

Is your hot water heated by gas? A gas boiler is going to be a minimum of 12kW so 45 minutes would use at least 9kWh of energy. An electric immersion heater is usually 3kW so would need 3 hours to put in the same energy (ignoring the fact that the immersion heater will be slightly more efficient).

You would have to have a very small tank to only need 45 minutes to heat with an immersion heater.

Yes, my heating is gas, but point is still valid (see post above) the immersion heater just being turned on for longer does not cost much more unless something is then using all the hot water.

I wasn't suggesting 45mins is enough, and 3 hours is definitely too long.

As I explained your gas system heating the water for 45 minutes is broadly equivalent to 3 hours of the immersion heater being on, so why would 3 hours be too long?

pochase

The OP does not have gas. Only electricity and log burner for heating.

k_man

peter3hg said:

k_man said:

peter3hg said:

k_man said:

pochase said:

wild666 said:

4.4 kWh per day is only 1606 kWh per year about £450 plus around £180 SC. You will be paying most of your yearly usage with one months DD if that is your true usage.
If BG say they can read the meter then if your usage is correct at no more than 4.4 kWh per day then BG are trying it on as £549 per month with no debt on the account is just short of £6,600 per year.

How do you get to 4.4KWh per day if an immersion heater is running 3 hours per day? That is already 9KWh.

The OP said he used 6499KWh since November 2021 (8 months), 800KWh per month in average.

Does that assume it is actually heating for the whole 3 hours?

If the tank is well insulated, it won't make much of a difference how long the immersion is on, even if 24/7 (unless it's faulty).

45 mins of heating the hot water is about enough in our house. Even though the heating is timed for 90 mins, it only actually heats for 45, because after 45 mins, the tank is full of hot water.

Unless the hot water being available changes shower habits!

Is your hot water heated by gas? A gas boiler is going to be a minimum of 12kW so 45 minutes would use at least 9kWh of energy. An electric immersion heater is usually 3kW so would need 3 hours to put in the same energy (ignoring the fact that the immersion heater will be slightly more efficient).

You would have to have a very small tank to only need 45 minutes to heat with an immersion heater.

Yes, my heating is gas, but point is still valid (see post above) the immersion heater just being turned on for longer does not cost much more unless something is then using all the hot water.

I wasn't suggesting 45mins is enough, and 3 hours is definitely too long.

As I explained your gas system heating the water for 45 minutes is broadly equivalent to 3 hours of the immersion heater being on, so why would 3 hours be too long?

Sorry, my sentence was ambiguous: 

I wasn't suggesting that 45mins is enough, and (I also wasn't suggesting that) 3 hours is definitely too long.

Or

I wasn't suggesting (45mins is enough, and 3 hours is definitely too long)

I wasn't even trying to compare 45 mins to 3 hours (as you stated the heating systems are different).
I was just pointing out that how long water heating is timed as on is not what drives significant cost, as long as the thermostat works.
It is how much water is being heated, and so for how long within the on period, it is actually heating that drives cost.

E.g if the immersion was on 24/7, and no water was being used, the immersion would not actually use much power (albeit what it did use due to thermal loses would be wasteful)

markin

Immersions usually seem to be set to 80c and we don't know if its a 100L, 200L or bigger tank, But the heat loss would be around 1kwh a day, And every shower could mean a top up of 2-4 kwh needed.

pochase

There are some good calculation tools on this site

https://www.sust-it.net/immersion-heater-energy-calculator.php

And here are the formula they use.

witchwood

Water tank is heated by electric. We have no gas. It is a 210 litre tank. Not sure on insulation etc but it is nearly 20 years old and so guessing may be up for renewal soon. Water temp is set at 60c. Shower is fed directly with water from tank. It is not a separate water heater. 

Mstty

witchwood said:

Water tank is heated by electric. We have no gas. It is a 210 litre tank. Not sure on insulation etc but it is nearly 20 years old and so guessing may be up for renewal soon. Water temp is set at 60c. Shower is fed directly with water from tank. It is not a separate water heater. 

Theres a saving do you need 60oC maybe once a week max for legionaires but rest of the time.espexially this time of year 50 max and if like us 45oC is plenty

markin

witchwood said:

Water tank is heated by electric. We have no gas. It is a 210 litre tank. Not sure on insulation etc but it is nearly 20 years old and so guessing may be up for renewal soon. Water temp is set at 60c. Shower is fed directly with water from tank. It is not a separate water heater. 

Has it got the same pressure as cold mains water?

Using that calculator and presuming a shower takes 50l the cost per shower would now be 73p and 52min to re-heat.

xzibit

Genuine question, why do people opt to pay by dd? Just get them to send you a bill every quarter based on your actual usage, pay. No loaning of your money. Only paying for what you’ve used. You can always put money away each month to cover the bills if you struggle with budgeting. 

Alnat1

Because it's more expensive to pay on receipt of the bill, the charges are higher, you're giving the energy company extra money if you pay that way. So for you no loaning them money, you're giving them money.