Parking stories in the News/media

Umkomaas

daveyjp said:

Good old Leeds Bradford again.

https://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/people/leeds-bradford-airport-woman-slapped-with-outrageous-ps100-parking-fine-despite-paying-correct-fee-4246530

I agree there are now so many signs for different car parks with similar names its a nightmare.

“Deterrents for dangerous driving are in place to protect the safety of all users.”

Wow.  Are the DVLA providing VCS with data now for 'dangerous driving'?  SRS will be having a field day!

Coupon-mad

The new ANPR and barrier system is not going well at Dorset County Hospital.  Not sure which PPC is responsible for this farce or who thought entrance barriers (causing long queues of people desperate to enter the site) with a machine too high for drivers to reach was a good idea.
 

Here's what the Hospital said when announcing the change:
https://www.dchft.nhs.uk/about-us/new-car-parking-and-payment-system-to-go-live-at-dorset-county-hospital/

"Chris Hearn, Chief Financial Officer at Dorset County Hospital, said:

“We hope the new barrier system will make it easier for those wanting to park on our site. People will no longer need to go to a payment machine to get a ticket when they arrive or worry about their ticket running out, as the system will make sure patients and visitors only pay for the length of their stay.”

BUT here is the immediate reality:
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/improvements-considered-delays-hospital-car-230000583.html

The new parking system came into operation just a month ago.  HOPELESS AND INACCESSIBLE.

One patient, Claire, said:

"When I went into labour, we couldn’t get through the barriers, they wouldn’t work. We didn’t have time to wait, so a worker let us through.”

Claire is not the only person that has had problems with parking at the DCH car park.

Another car park user said: “Old people have to hold onto their cars to get out to get a ticket and then have to get back in again because the ticket machine is too high.

“People are getting out of their cars to reach and people from behind are getting out to help the people in front - People can’t get in and out of the hospital freely.”

Richard Southam was walking by the hospital on his way to work when he saw around ’12 to 14’ cars queueing at the barrier to get into the car park. "There appears, as I walk past regularly, to be issues with the system, or accessibility for people in their cars to get their tickets.”

Le_Kirk

That's weird, one report from the hospital states that patients do not need a ticket and another one states that people have to leave their cars to take a ticket!  The way these (normally) work is that the ANPR camera captures the VRM on the way in and, on leaving, at the pay machine, you start to type in your VRM and the system searches for matches, you then select yours, pay and leave.  The ANPR camera at the exit recognises your VRM and the fact that you have paid and raises the barrier.  There is in fact no need for a barrier on the way in!  Someone has got this horribly wrong.

Umkomaas

Le_Kirk said:

That's weird, one report from the hospital states that patients do not need a ticket and another one states that people have to leave their cars to take a ticket!  The way these (normally) work is that the ANPR camera captures the VRM on the way in and, on leaving, at the pay machine, you start to type in your VRM and the system searches for matches, you then select yours, pay and leave.  The ANPR camera at the exit recognises your VRM and the fact that you have paid and raises the barrier.  There is in fact no need for a barrier on the way in!  Someone has got this horribly wrong.

Experienced that arrangement going back a few years at the Birmingham School of Dentistry. It was run by APCOA and seemed to work extremely efficiently. No barriers, just ANPR capture on the way in and out. Type your VRM into machine in the foyer, get photo of your car's entrance, confirm, then back to the car and drive out. One APCOA man roaming around the car park, seemed friendly enough.  The experience was one you should imagine it to be ....... but is so rare to find. 

If they were all like this example, I'm sure we wouldn't have much to do here. Maybe Sir Greg himself would not even have been troubled!

Le_Kirk

Our local shopping centre is (almost) like that except you do take a ticket, stick it in payment m/c on exit and then the camera at the barrier recognises your VRM and that you have paid and the barrier lifts, your ticket is your receipt.  A local huge Leisure park has a non-barrier entrance with a barrier exit and (some) of the Cambridge Park-and-Ride schemes are the same.  When I was visiting Bath recently one of the car parks there was free if you used the Park-and-Ride but you paid if not - how it recognised the difference I do not know.

Trainerman

Le_Kirk said:

That's weird, one report from the hospital states that patients do not need a ticket and another one states that people have to leave their cars to take a ticket!  The way these (normally) work is that the ANPR camera captures the VRM on the way in and, on leaving, at the pay machine, you start to type in your VRM and the system searches for matches, you then select yours, pay and leave.  The ANPR camera at the exit recognises your VRM and the fact that you have paid and raises the barrier.  There is in fact no need for a barrier on the way in!  Someone has got this horribly wrong.

Shrewsbury Hospital is similar, though no barrier. In my experience it works well, so why can't other ANPR sites run like this ???

Oh yes, no chance for the scammers to use weird unseen rules to rip people off !!

Whatever2023

Coupon-mad said:

And talking of Councils, here we have one admitting to illegally letting Smart Parking operate with ANPR at a Council-owned shopping centre:

I feel a FOI request coming on to Castle Point Borough Council for the number of contract law 'PCNs' issued and a copy of the landowner/parking firm contract.

Anyone here live in the area? Barry Beavis?

Needs a complaint to the DVLA and to the Borough Council auditors that (allegedly):

(a) the DVLA data was obtained unlawfully;

(b) the parking charges were issued unlawfully by the agents because this isn't housing land so it cannot be operated 'as if it were private land'

and (this is not 'allegedly', this below is fact):

(c). ANPR has been banned for Local Authority parking enforcement since the Deregulation Act 2015.  

(d). The DFT's Robert Goodwill's letter was reiterated in Sept 2022 by the DLUHC, so this is illegal (especially with banned ANPR):

Oh dear...

Housing Land has different legal status as do some Country Parks AIUI, but a public shopping car park certainly doesn't.

Wycombe District Council was banned by the DVLA from getting any keeper data (at all, even for on street Penalties) when they made the same mistake, but they were sussed and reported to thd DVLA quicker:

This allegedly unlawful regime has been going on for three years - that's going to be tens of thousands of pounds allegedly extorted illegally from locals...

The Robert Goodwill letter relates to LA’s accessing Keeper data, and simply states that any requests to the DVLA for data are likely to be refused as they are not a member of an ATA.

The operator will be obtaining data from the DVLA in their own name as creditor; so perfectly legit as they are a member of an ATA (although needs to be non-pofa according to the Ombudsman).

Coupon-mad

Whatever2023 said:

Coupon-mad said:

And talking of Councils, here we have one admitting to illegally letting Smart Parking operate with ANPR at a Council-owned shopping centre:

I feel a FOI request coming on to Castle Point Borough Council for the number of contract law 'PCNs' issued and a copy of the landowner/parking firm contract.

Anyone here live in the area? Barry Beavis?

Needs a complaint to the DVLA and to the Borough Council auditors that (allegedly):

(a) the DVLA data was obtained unlawfully;

(b) the parking charges were issued unlawfully by the agents because this isn't housing land so it cannot be operated 'as if it were private land'

and (this is not 'allegedly', this below is fact):

(c). ANPR has been banned for Local Authority parking enforcement since the Deregulation Act 2015.  

(d). The DFT's Robert Goodwill's letter was reiterated in Sept 2022 by the DLUHC, so this is illegal (especially with banned ANPR):

Oh dear...

Housing Land has different legal status as do some Country Parks AIUI, but a public shopping car park certainly doesn't.

Wycombe District Council was banned by the DVLA from getting any keeper data (at all, even for on street Penalties) when they made the same mistake, but they were sussed and reported to thd DVLA quicker:

This allegedly unlawful regime has been going on for three years - that's going to be tens of thousands of pounds allegedly extorted illegally from locals...

The Robert Goodwill letter relates to LA’s accessing Keeper data, and simply states that any requests to the DVLA for data are likely to be refused as they are not a member of an ATA.

The operator will be obtaining data from the DVLA in their own name as creditor; so perfectly legit as they are a member of an ATA (although needs to be non-pofa according to the Ombudsman).

Interesting first post.

Mainly incorrect though.  This bit is partly right:

"needs to be non-pofa according to the Ombudsman" 

...yes, but the DLUHC agree with Robert Goodwill and the only exceptions could (arguably) be housing land or Country parks.  They come under separate legislation.

But a shopper's car park doesn't!

You sound like you read the back-page puff piece by the BPA's elderly sermoniser Kelvin Reynolds in Parking News where he usually ends up just slagging off the DLUHC.

It's all a but shabby on the part of PPC World, don't you think?!  A difficult time I'm sure.

Whatever2023

The DCLG letter also refers to the LA requesting data and POFA; however, it’s not the LA that’s requesting it.

Am not sure if DCLG are familiar with Para 4(6) of POFA.

I guess the above is why these operators are getting the data they ask for.

I read about the ombudsman ruling years ago, strange that Kelvin Reynolds is mentioning it now; maybe he’s just a bit slow lol.

Whatever2023

*DLUHC (won’t let me edit)