Can they make me pay for professional clean?

genericn17

It is 100% incorrect to say "The landlord has nothing to prove". It's also incorrect to say asking for a receipt is "proof of something that someone doesn’t need to defend". If the landlord wants to make deductions from a deposit - because the oven hasn't been professionally cleaned or anything else - then it will go to the deposit protection scheme for a dispute, and the landlord will have to prove/defend the condition it was in when they moved in. That's literally why those schemes exist! And the time for the landlord to get that evidence was two years ago!

If it wasn't professionally cleaned before the tenants moved in, it's unreasonable to ask the tenants to pay now (it may still be unreasonable if they can get it to the same standards themselves.)

I don't understand why you're still talking about the tenants making a report during the tenancy - that has ZERO to do with it. It's about comparing the state when they moved in, with the state when they moved out.

Also, it's not "snidy" to not want your landlord to make unfair deductions. I paid for a professional clean when I left my last rented house because it was easier and I could afford it, but I would never have been able to afford that as a student or fresh out of uni, so I always just cleaned things myself. I've always had my deposit back in full as well, but that involved standing up for myself and challenging the landlord when they were trying to take the !!!!!! - as landlords often do. They are not your friend and you don't need to let them get away with unreasonable demands. Most likely you'll never speak to them again.

anselld

There is zero chance you will get a student oven clean to professional standard.  You will spend a frustrating amount of time plus some money on product and it will probably still need doing again.   Save yourselves the trouble for the sake of £20 each.

Ath_Wat

lisyloo said:

The landlord has nothing to prove and if the tenants  didn’t feel the property was clean before they arrived then they should have mentioned it before as they’ve been there since 2020.
Asking for proof right now ( 2 years later) is really snide just to try to deliberately trip up the Landlord over a measly 50 quid.
they almost certainly have receipts but if it was me I’d consider it pretty snidy if no report had been made in 2 years,
Its terrible advice as it’s not a reasonable action asking the landlord to prove something they don’t need to prove and risks putting the relationship on a nasty footing,

It's not about the oven not being clean - it's about it having been professionally cleaned.  You do understand the difference don't you?  Nobody is going to lodge complaints about an oven that is clean but not professionally cleaned.

If the oven was not professionally cleaned before move in then of course they are within their rights, and within common moral good sense, to refuse to pay for it to be done after they move out.

If you don't know what the difference between a clean oven and a professionally cleaned oven is, say so, and someone can explain.

Noneforit999

Can you be bothered with the drama of cleaning the oven for the sake of £50 between you?

Time you have bought the cleaner, spent an hour or so cleaning it to find its cleaner but still not spotless and then the landlord might still want it cleaner.

If it were me, I would just pay the £50 and get it properly done. I am of the opinion that some battles are worth fighting and some are not, this it the latter for me. 

Ath_Wat

anselld said:

There is zero chance you will get a student oven clean to professional standard.  You will spend a frustrating amount of time plus some money on product and it will probably still need doing again.   Save yourselves the trouble for the sake of £20 each.

You are assuming it was professionally cleaned to begin with. if it wasn't, there is no obligation on them to hand it back in that condition.

Ath_Wat

Noneforit999 said:

Can you be bothered with the drama of cleaning the oven for the sake of £50 between you?

Time you have bought the cleaner, spent an hour or so cleaning it to find its cleaner but still not spotless and then the landlord might still want it cleaner.

If it were me, I would just pay the £50 and get it properly done. I am of the opinion that some battles are worth fighting and some are not, this it the latter for me. 

It doesn't matter what the landlord wants; what matters is the condition the landlord gave it to them in.  A professionally cleaned oven is not assumed at the start of a tenancy.

[Deleted User]

Ath_Wat said:

anselld said:

There is zero chance you will get a student oven clean to professional standard.  You will spend a frustrating amount of time plus some money on product and it will probably still need doing again.   Save yourselves the trouble for the sake of £20 each.

You are assuming it was professionally cleaned to begin with. if it wasn't, there is no obligation on them to hand it back in that condition.

With an oven, id say its either clean or not. There arent really degrees of cleaning. 

They don't mention that it was crusted with burnt foodstuffs when they moved in so it must have been clean...

If there are stubborn burnt on marks they will be at it for days. From personal experience. Most people wont persist like I did so the £ might be about right.

Ath_Wat

[Deleted User] said:

Ath_Wat said:

anselld said:

There is zero chance you will get a student oven clean to professional standard.  You will spend a frustrating amount of time plus some money on product and it will probably still need doing again.   Save yourselves the trouble for the sake of £20 each.

You are assuming it was professionally cleaned to begin with. if it wasn't, there is no obligation on them to hand it back in that condition.

With an oven, id say its either clean or not. There arent really degrees of cleaning. 

They don't mention that it was crusted with burnt foodstuffs when they moved in so it must have been clean...

If there are stubborn burnt on marks they will be at it for days. From personal experience. Most people wont persist like I did so the £ might be about right.

There absolutely are degrees of clean.  Look at post 5 in this thread, quoted below.  Professional oven cleaning is a specialist service, and it is not in any way the same thing as just having a clean oven.  Professionally clean is much more than not being "crusted with burnt foodstuff".

In fact I might argue that even if it was in professionally clean condition when they moved in there is no obligation to return it to that state, any more than there is a need to return a  brand new oven to brand new condition.

bouicca21 said:

Getting an oven cleaner is the best 60 quid I’ve ever spent.   The oven looked brand new as if it had just come out of the showroom.   There is no way I could have got it looking that good.

But it all comes down to what it was like when you moved in.  That’s the state you need to get it back to.

Noneforit999

Ath_Wat said:

Noneforit999 said:

Can you be bothered with the drama of cleaning the oven for the sake of £50 between you?

Time you have bought the cleaner, spent an hour or so cleaning it to find its cleaner but still not spotless and then the landlord might still want it cleaner.

If it were me, I would just pay the £50 and get it properly done. I am of the opinion that some battles are worth fighting and some are not, this it the latter for me. 

It doesn't matter what the landlord wants; what matters is the condition the landlord gave it to them in.  A professionally cleaned oven is not assumed at the start of a tenancy.

Like I said, there are some battles to have and others to concede. For the sake of £20 each, just get the oven cleaned. 

I look at something like this and think, how much is it going to cost me in materials and how much of my time will it take.

If its £5 in materials and will take 5 minutes, it might be worth it.

If its £15 in materials, a couple of hours to clean the oven, the potential to burn my skin with the cleaner, the back and forth with the landlord for hours disagreeing about it.......I would pay the £50.

Ath_Wat

Noneforit999 said:

Ath_Wat said:

Noneforit999 said:

Can you be bothered with the drama of cleaning the oven for the sake of £50 between you?

Time you have bought the cleaner, spent an hour or so cleaning it to find its cleaner but still not spotless and then the landlord might still want it cleaner.

If it were me, I would just pay the £50 and get it properly done. I am of the opinion that some battles are worth fighting and some are not, this it the latter for me. 

It doesn't matter what the landlord wants; what matters is the condition the landlord gave it to them in.  A professionally cleaned oven is not assumed at the start of a tenancy.

Like I said, there are some battles to have and others to concede. For the sake of £20 each, just get the oven cleaned. 

I look at something like this and think, how much is it going to cost me in materials and how much of my time will it take.

If its £5 in materials and will take 5 minutes, it might be worth it.

If its £15 in materials, a couple of hours to clean the oven, the potential to burn my skin with the cleaner, the back and forth with the landlord for hours disagreeing about it.......I would pay the £50.

Well indeed, but that's not the point in question.

If the landlord is insisting you get it to a condition that will require " £15 in materials, a couple of hours to clean the oven, the potential to burn my skin with the cleaner" when it wasn't like that when they  gave it to you, then you shouldn't do that or pay the £60.

£5 in materials and 10 minutes might be enough to get it back to the state where it was when you moved in - the likelihood is you might have materials anyway, if you've been cleaning it while living there.

The idea that "if someone asks me for money they are not entitled to, I will give it to them if it's less trouble to do that than argue" is not one I subscribe to.  If you do actually think that, I'll have a pound please.