Should I rewire the boiler circuit?

FataVerde

I had an EICR before purchasing a Victorian flat conversion and it found that the cooker circuit needs to be completely rewired and that the boiler circuit is overrated. I've since had several electricians come for a quote and 3 of them said the boiler is fine (it's plugged in a socket with its own fuse), it's just that the new regulations require an extra socket there.

1. The electrician I hired suggested he could also rewire the boiler so it has its own dedicated circuit. It currently shares a circuit with the lounge sockets. However, since I plan to install new sockets in the lounge and sink existing ones, he'd actually create a separate circuit for the lounge sockets, leaving the boiler alone on the old circuit. So I'm wondering if it's really worth paying the extra £200 for a boiler circuit rewire. The attraction is that I won't need to lift floors in the future were the boiler circuit, which is currently fine, to break.

2. He also suggested replacing one of the bathroom lights with an IP rated one since it's close to the shower, but quoted £45 for material and labour. Does this sound like a fair quote? 

Bendy_House

FataVerde said:

I had an EICR before purchasing a Victorian flat conversion and it found that the cooker circuit needs to be completely rewired and that the boiler circuit is overrated. I've since had several electricians come for a quote and 3 of them said the boiler is fine (it's plugged in a socket with its own fuse), it's just that the new regulations require an extra socket there.

1. The electrician I hired suggested he could also rewire the boiler so it has its own dedicated circuit. It currently shares a circuit with the lounge sockets. However, since I plan to install new sockets in the lounge and sink existing ones, he'd actually create a separate circuit for the lounge sockets, leaving the boiler alone on the old circuit. So I'm wondering if it's really worth paying the extra £200 for a boiler circuit rewire. The attraction is that I won't need to lift floors in the future were the boiler circuit, which is currently fine, to break.

2. He also suggested replacing one of the bathroom lights with an IP rated one since it's close to the shower, but quoted £45 for material and labour. Does this sound like a fair quote? 

Sounds like a mixed bag! I cannot see how the boiler circuit is 'overrated', any more than saying that a phone charger plugged into a double socket is also 'overrated'. The individual 'rating' is dependent on the appliance, and its MAX is controlled by its fuse; the boiler's plug will presumably have a 3A jobbie in there - so cannot exceed 3A. So it isn't 'overrated'.

I don't understand the 'new regulations' that require a 'new socket' there, unless what they mean is a DP FSU (ie the boiler wire goes straight into the faceplate, and there's a dedicated switch on it to isolate the boiler:

To fit one of these - spurred off the existing socket if necessary - is a cheap and simple task. But I don't understand why its essential - I mean, no-one else is going to be forced to do this as a retro move!

(If your boiler is wired into a plug which goes into a normal socket, then that socket MUST either have a DP (double-pole) switch so that both L&N are isolated when it's turned off, or else the socket must be without a switch at all - so you actually need to pull out the plug to isolate the boiler (so, again, both L&N are isolated). So, if the existing socket is SP, then it should be changed. And it's best changed to one of these FSUs)

1) The boiler doesn't need its own circuit - that's overkill imo. I mean, just how many breakers will you have in your CU if you do this? The only reason you might want it to have this is if the lounge circuit is tripped off for some reason, so your boiler will go off too. But what are the chances? When did this last happen to you? Has it ever happened to you?!

Not sure that reusing the old lounge circuit solely for the boiler is a good idea, as you mentioned you'd be 'sinking' the old boxes, so you really don't want all that existing 'capped' cabling still kept live in the lounge, just so that the boiler gets its separate juice! Personally, I'd simply add the boiler's FSU (that thing above) to the new circuit, as a general replication of what you currently have, and then completely isolate the old wiring. A new circuit with new sockets and a new FSU is extremely unlikely to go wrong. If a device plugged in in your lounge trips the MCB, then your boiler will also go off, but you just unplug the miscreant device and turn the MCB back on. If a boiler fault trips the MCB, then you will lose all the power to your lounge sockets - until you turn off the boiler at the FSU and switch the MCB back on. Either event is unlikely. And not a major pain.

2) Replacing a light fitting for £45 P&L sounds fair so me. Worth making it an LED fitting while you are at it - 'fit and forget'?

 

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fenwick458

exactly what did the EICR say was wrong with the boiler circuit? if 3 other electricians have all said it's fine, then it's probably fine!
IP rated light in the bathroom, the price defiantly sounds fair, but how close is it to the shower? is the bathroom lighting circuit protected by an RCD?

Bendy_House said:

1) The boiler doesn't need its own circuit - that's overkill imo. I mean, just how many breakers will you have in your CU if you do this? The only reason you might want it to have this is if the lounge circuit is tripped off for some reason, so your boiler will go off too. But what are the chances? When did this last happen to you? Has it ever happened to you?!

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I'm not saying it's necessary, but I'd always like to put the boiler on their own circuit if it's easy enough to do, as it greatly reduces the likelihood of the boiler going off when there's a fault elsewhere.
just because it's never happened, doesn't mean it never will. would be sods law for a fault to develop on a circuit somewhere which causes a power loss to the boiler and requires an electrician to come out to fix it, on a bank holiday in the middle of winter when you really need the heating!
having said that if the boiler is currently plugged in then that does afford you degree of flexibility,  would be quite easy to fix run an extension lead to another socket that's on a different circuit to the boiler and plug it in

FataVerde

@Bendy_House Many thanks! This is really great advice and helps me understand better what the sparks were suggesting. My boiler is currently plugged into a DP socket so now I know what they meant by 'a different plug.'

I agree on the boiler circuit. It does seem overkill.

FataVerde

@fenwick458 Thanks for the reply. Yes, the boiler is plugged in so great to know there would a be an easy solution.

The EICR report said "Circuit no 4 (boiler) overrated C2' and 'Boiler socket loose C3.'

The light is about half a meter to a meter from the shower (and it's not LED either). There's another light right above and that is IP protected. 

Bendy_House

Fen' will hopefully comment on whether that light fitting distance is ok, but between what this sparky said about the boiler socket AND the light fitting, it sounds as tho' we may have a pedant...

fenwick458

bathroom light, assuming the ceiling is higher than 2.25m then anything on the ceiling is outside of the zones. normally you'll see IP rated lights used only for directly over the bath of shower even if the ceiling is 2.4m. so if the light is half a meter away it would be ok if the ceiling is higher than 2.25m

and for the codes on the EICR, if you have a 3A fuse in the plug supplying the boiler I really don't see how it can be over rated. and even if it was, there's no way it's C2 

FataVerde

fenwick458 said:

bathroom light, assuming the ceiling is higher than 2.25m then anything on the ceiling is outside of the zones. normally you'll see IP rated lights used only for directly over the bath of shower even if the ceiling is 2.4m. so if the light is half a meter away it would be ok if the ceiling is higher than 2.25m

and for the codes on the EICR, if you have a 3A fuse in the plug supplying the boiler I really don't see how it can be over rated. and even if it was, there's no way it's C2 

I had asked the electrician to be thorough as this was a pre-purchase and didn't want to miss some major thing. Maybe that's why he overdid it.

FataVerde

fenwick458 said:

bathroom light, assuming the ceiling is higher than 2.25m then anything on the ceiling is outside of the zones. normally you'll see IP rated lights used only for directly over the bath of shower even if the ceiling is 2.4m. so if the light is half a meter away it would be ok if the ceiling is higher than 2.25m

and for the codes on the EICR, if you have a 3A fuse in the plug supplying the boiler I really don't see how it can be over rated. and even if it was, there's no way it's C2 

Thanks for such a specialist answer! I measured the distances and the ceiling is 2.46m high and the light is about 80-90 cm away from the shower. Does this mean I don't really need an IP rated light there?

On the overrated circuit, my current electrician explained it has to do with the fuse connection, which was made as for a ring circuit and this was not a ring circuit, but since he is replacing the fuseboard, this will get solved.

Incidentally, he found the boiler was connected with only one lounge socket, but he will take that socket off and needs just a  bit of cable to extend the boiler's circuit to the fuseboard so I will have the boiler on a separate circuit anyway. All the new sockets in living room and bedroom will now be on their own circuit.

FataVerde

And here's the boiler plug 

Bendy_House

If that's a single-pole socket, then it doesn't conform. But it'll all be happy once a FSU is fitted instead.

And since all that needs doing to the boiler circuit is to remove one unnecessary lounge socket, that's all good too.

Result!