Car & bicycle incident - claim question.

whatwasmyname

I contacted the solicitor to ask what the charge would be should I win. I said I assumed it would be on a percentage basis rather than a flat fee although I didn't know as I'd never been in this situation before.

Their response was

Regarding the funding -There is no success fee charged within the CFA so no deduction will be made from your damages in respect of our legal fees. The insurance premium will be deducted from any damages awarded upon successful conclusion of the claim. The amount of the premium is dependent on the value of damages awarded.

Just wondering if anyone could convert that in to English as to what they're saying to me because that's gone totally over my head.

Ditzy_Mitzy

whatwasmyname said:

I contacted the solicitor to ask what the charge would be should I win. I said I assumed it would be on a percentage basis rather than a flat fee although I didn't know as I'd never been in this situation before.

Their response was

Regarding the funding -There is no success fee charged within the CFA so no deduction will be made from your damages in respect of our legal fees. The insurance premium will be deducted from any damages awarded upon successful conclusion of the claim. The amount of the premium is dependent on the value of damages awarded.

Just wondering if anyone could convert that in to English as to what they're saying to me because that's gone totally over my head.

It sounds to me as if the solicitors are insuring themselves against a loss in court, taking out a policy that pays out to cover their work if things don't go their way.  If the case is lost, the solicitor pays the insurer.  If the case is won, you pay the insurer from the compensation award.  The insurer and solicitor are, no doubt, the same entity or if not have some sort of reciprocal agreement whereby a percentage of the premium paid then goes back to the solicitor.  

Unfortunately this appears to be an obfuscation tactic on the part of the solicitor, as it releases them from any obligation to provide a clear quote in terms of percentage.  They can then say 'nothing to do with me, guv'nor' when it comes to the eventual insurance premium cost, which appears to be variable.  Tread carefully.

Aretnap

"The amount of the premium is dependent on the value of damages awarded." - makes sense but you need to ask them to be more precise. You should know in advance HOW it depends on the amount of damages awarded. Do they mean the insurance premium is X% of the damages (in which case the end result is likely to be the same as if they simply took a winners fee of X% if damages), or do they mean that the premium is £X if the damages are less than £Y, but £Z if they are greater than £Y? There should be a formula, which you should be clue to see before you agree to it. 

RE the value of the bike, be aware that the driver (and his insurer) is only liable for the second hand value of the bike, not its new cost. I don't know what the second hand market for bikes is like, but I assume that the secondhand value of a bike that was £500 five years ago isn't a huge amount. So the bike will almost certainly be written off. What you do with the money paid out for it is up to you - you might choose to put it towards repairs if you want to keep the bike, buy a replacement second hand bike, put it towards a shiny new road bike, or forget about cycling altogether and spend it on something else entirely. 

whatwasmyname

Thanks for explaining it because it was as clear as mud to me.

They did specify in their email which contained a questionnaire I need to fill out that by answering their attached questions, it does not tie me to a legal contract at that point (or words to that effect). I don't particularly want to jump in until I know what the charge will be, even if it's percent. 

"The insurer and solicitor are, no doubt, the same entity" - I'd have to say i've misunderstood you there as they're different people to me so that can't be how you meant it I'll assume.

The guys insurance company still haven't contacted me back. I phoned them Friday & they said phone them back Monday for an update. I thought this weird as why should I phone them? What if they don't have an update when I call? And when I call after that and for the next 100 calls?

So I call Monday and they have no idea what's going on before eventually finding the claim details & telling me they're still to get in touch with their guy & they'll contact me when they do.

So something isn't right. Either he's not answering them, they're not calling him or they have but they're not following through on updating me.

Grey_Critic

My injuries (in 2017) were caused when I took an unscheduled trip over the handlebars.

I walked away just (I thought) shook up. My wife took he to A&E at 5.00am next day.

Broken collar bone and 3 ribs cracked was the initial diagnosis. It turned out I had done *every* rib on the right hand side. I still have pain but there is nothing that can be done about that.

I was lucky - the following week a guy in an accident about 10 miles away died from similar injuries. A friend of many years did not believe in helmets and I attended his funeral.

Stop fretting over how cheap - worry about the consequences long term if you don't have the proper legal help.

Have a look on the internet for cycling clubs in your area - no doubt some of their members will be able to advise you from experience.

Bluebell1000

With the claim I had, I went with a local no win no fee firm, and they were very clear about the 'up to 25%' commitment upfront, and showed us the contract - including talking us through everything - before signing. My husband spoke to people from 3 firms and went with the one he felt was clearest and competent, before I then did the main meeting to sign up.

The solicitors should arrange for you to have various medical assessments, and may be able to arrange an interim payment if loss of wages is an issue.

I would definitely suggest speaking to several firms!

Car_54

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

whatwasmyname said:

I contacted the solicitor to ask what the charge would be should I win. I said I assumed it would be on a percentage basis rather than a flat fee although I didn't know as I'd never been in this situation before.

Their response was

Regarding the funding -There is no success fee charged within the CFA so no deduction will be made from your damages in respect of our legal fees. The insurance premium will be deducted from any damages awarded upon successful conclusion of the claim. The amount of the premium is dependent on the value of damages awarded.

Just wondering if anyone could convert that in to English as to what they're saying to me because that's gone totally over my head.

It sounds to me as if the solicitors are insuring themselves against a loss in court, taking out a policy that pays out to cover their work if things don't go their way.  If the case is lost, the solicitor pays the insurer.  If the case is won, you pay the insurer from the compensation award.  The insurer and solicitor are, no doubt, the same entity or if not have some sort of reciprocal agreement whereby a percentage of the premium paid then goes back to the solicitor.  

Unfortunately this appears to be an obfuscation tactic on the part of the solicitor, as it releases them from any obligation to provide a clear quote in terms of percentage.  They can then say 'nothing to do with me, guv'nor' when it comes to the eventual insurance premium cost, which appears to be variable.  Tread carefully.

Would that be legal?

Jenni_D

Car_54 said:

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

whatwasmyname said:

I contacted the solicitor to ask what the charge would be should I win. I said I assumed it would be on a percentage basis rather than a flat fee although I didn't know as I'd never been in this situation before.

Their response was

Regarding the funding -There is no success fee charged within the CFA so no deduction will be made from your damages in respect of our legal fees. The insurance premium will be deducted from any damages awarded upon successful conclusion of the claim. The amount of the premium is dependent on the value of damages awarded.

Just wondering if anyone could convert that in to English as to what they're saying to me because that's gone totally over my head.

It sounds to me as if the solicitors are insuring themselves against a loss in court, taking out a policy that pays out to cover their work if things don't go their way.  If the case is lost, the solicitor pays the insurer.  If the case is won, you pay the insurer from the compensation award.  The insurer and solicitor are, no doubt, the same entity or if not have some sort of reciprocal agreement whereby a percentage of the premium paid then goes back to the solicitor.  

Unfortunately this appears to be an obfuscation tactic on the part of the solicitor, as it releases them from any obligation to provide a clear quote in terms of percentage.  They can then say 'nothing to do with me, guv'nor' when it comes to the eventual insurance premium cost, which appears to be variable.  Tread carefully.

Would that be legal?

That sounds very Wonga-ish

whatwasmyname

Grey_Critic said:

My injuries (in 2017) were caused when I took an unscheduled trip over the handlebars.

I walked away just (I thought) shook up. My wife took he to A&E at 5.00am next day.

Broken collar bone and 3 ribs cracked was the initial diagnosis. It turned out I had done *every* rib on the right hand side. I still have pain but there is nothing that can be done about that.

I was lucky - the following week a guy in an accident about 10 miles away died from similar injuries. A friend of many years did not believe in helmets and I attended his funeral.

Stop fretting over how cheap - worry about the consequences long term if you don't have the proper legal help.

Have a look on the internet for cycling clubs in your area - no doubt some of their members will be able to advise you from experience.

The helmet thing is a whole other debate but for me you can't really argue with the evidence & as such I don't ride without a helmet. 
In fact I was watching Katie Kookaburra's YouTube channel recently  where she came off her bike & had some nasty facial bruising. She was talking about this thing called MIPS that I'd never even heard of.

So a bit of Google work later & I learn about what this MIPS is.
I then remember a friend of my wife having an accident earlier in the year while on their bicycle. Story short they took a knock to the head & they're actually having quite a bad time with it - memory loss, tolerance issues to noise amongst other issues, even now.
So I hopped on Wiggle & got myself a new helmet with MIPS. Nope it wont make me indestructible but it should be better than my previous helmet.

Regards the worrying about long term consequences - I certainly am. I know the GP says he expects me to be at baseline after a month and get feeling back in my elbow but from personal experience with an operation I had, I'm expecting to not get feeling back. I'm not negative, i'm just realistic. While there's no feeling there there's going to remain no feeling until there is feeling. Simple.Bluebell1000 said:

With the claim I had, I went with a local no win no fee firm, and they were very clear about the 'up to 25%' commitment upfront, and showed us the contract - including talking us through everything - before signing. My husband spoke to people from 3 firms and went with the one he felt was clearest and competent, before I then did the main meeting to sign up.

The solicitors should arrange for you to have various medical assessments, and may be able to arrange an interim payment if loss of wages is an issue.

I would definitely suggest speaking to several firms!

Thank you for the advice. I think this is something I should do as I don't like vague wishy washy responses. Makes me wonder what they're trying to hide.

Ditzy_Mitzy

Car_54 said:

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

whatwasmyname said:

I contacted the solicitor to ask what the charge would be should I win. I said I assumed it would be on a percentage basis rather than a flat fee although I didn't know as I'd never been in this situation before.

Their response was

Regarding the funding -There is no success fee charged within the CFA so no deduction will be made from your damages in respect of our legal fees. The insurance premium will be deducted from any damages awarded upon successful conclusion of the claim. The amount of the premium is dependent on the value of damages awarded.

Just wondering if anyone could convert that in to English as to what they're saying to me because that's gone totally over my head.

It sounds to me as if the solicitors are insuring themselves against a loss in court, taking out a policy that pays out to cover their work if things don't go their way.  If the case is lost, the solicitor pays the insurer.  If the case is won, you pay the insurer from the compensation award.  The insurer and solicitor are, no doubt, the same entity or if not have some sort of reciprocal agreement whereby a percentage of the premium paid then goes back to the solicitor.  

Unfortunately this appears to be an obfuscation tactic on the part of the solicitor, as it releases them from any obligation to provide a clear quote in terms of percentage.  They can then say 'nothing to do with me, guv'nor' when it comes to the eventual insurance premium cost, which appears to be variable.  Tread carefully.

Would that be legal?

Of course it is, why?  They may not be the 'same' company for all sorts of reasons, but can share directors and holding companies.  A quick look on the Companies House records for Slater Gordon, Fieldfisher and Simpson Millar, three random results for the query 'no win no fee solicitor' on a search engine, reveals all have directors who also hold directorships of financial advisers or money management firms.  IFAs, as we know, are more than capable of arranging the odd insurance policy here and there.