Are consumer rights B2C only or also B2B?

penguineater

I am looking to purchase a TV through my LTD company and have been told by a retailer it is classed as commercial use and their 6 year warranty no longer applies - They only offer 1 year standard manufacturers warranty and then try and upsell me a 3 year warranty.

My question is:

1. If I bought the TV and it stopped working due to manufacturer defect on year 4 (without buying any extended warranty) - would they need to fix it based on goods lasting a 'reasonable time' or is this only for private individuals?

Appreciate any help.

user1977

Consumer rights are (as the name suggests) only for consumers. As soon as you become a business then the law assumes you're able to use your commercial clout and vast legal team in order to negotiate suitable terms (or at least understand the risks you're taking).

penguineater

user1977 said:

Consumer rights are (as the name suggests) only for consumers. As soon as you become a business then the law assumes you're able to use your commercial clout and vast legal team in order to negotiate suitable terms (or at least understand the risks you're taking).

That's a shame.. I guess I could walk into a different retailer in-person and buy it with my business card and if any issues years later, just say i'm a consumer and make a claim within the 5 year warranty.

unholyangel

penguineater said:

user1977 said:

Consumer rights are (as the name suggests) only for consumers. As soon as you become a business then the law assumes you're able to use your commercial clout and vast legal team in order to negotiate suitable terms (or at least understand the risks you're taking).

That's a shame.. I guess I could walk into a different retailer in-person and buy it with my business card and if any issues years later, just say i'm a consumer and make a claim within the 5 year warranty.

Surely if youre going to commit fraud, it should at least be for something worth the potential custodial sentence.

Btw, they can tell the card is commercial or not just from the card number. Because businesses can be charged extra depending on payment type, while consumers can't be.

shiraz99

Are you genuinely going to be using the TV for your business or are you hoping to purchase it and, for example reclaim the VAT?

penguineater

unholyangel said:

penguineater said:

user1977 said:

Consumer rights are (as the name suggests) only for consumers. As soon as you become a business then the law assumes you're able to use your commercial clout and vast legal team in order to negotiate suitable terms (or at least understand the risks you're taking).

That's a shame.. I guess I could walk into a different retailer in-person and buy it with my business card and if any issues years later, just say i'm a consumer and make a claim within the 5 year warranty.

Surely if youre going to commit fraud, it should at least be for something worth the potential custodial sentence.

Btw, they can tell the card is commercial or not just from the card number. Because businesses can be charged extra depending on payment type, while consumers can't be.

shiraz99 said:

Are you genuinely going to be using the TV for your business or are you hoping to purchase it and, for example reclaim the VAT?

It's a genuine business cost that will be used every day for my work PC screen and I am not VAT registered as my income does not meet the VAT threshold.

I've never done a warranty claim before so I don't know how the process works or varies per retailer. I've never seen any signs in-store that says TV warranty for example, is for non-commercial use only.

The last time I bought a TV in-store, I paid for it by card and signed no paperwork agreeing to the terms for warranty claims or anything.

So it's my understanding if I went into a store and paid for it via my business card and did not sign anything - I should get the 5 years warranty as advertised unless they somehow discover I paid with my business card AND they have terms & conditions online specifically excluding commercial purchases - but in reality, will they check in such detail?

And is it even fair to refuse the 5y warranty if the customer wasn't made aware when making the purchase?

To be clear i'm not talking about the 6 year warranty company in the original post, I will not be purchasing from there as it is known they do not provide more than 1y warranty for commercial purchases.

It all seems a bit of a grey area to me and I can easily believe lots of people go out and purchase things (not just a TV) and get normal consumer warranty simply because the retailer does not check they are a commercial customer.

Sandtree

Not grey at all and works because most people aren't willing to go to jail over a TV.

Your statutory rights are defined by the entity buying it... your company buys it then its a B2B contract and so CRA doesn't apply, though the SoGA may apply as it hasn't been repealed for the limited protections it provides to vSMEs

Any warranties etc above and beyond your statutory rights all come down to the T&Cs which may differentiate between B2C and B2B sales. Note that businesses are not always worse, on a recent thread here someone didn't get a loan item whilst theirs was repaired as this clause was limited to B2B sales and not consumers. 

Yes you can lie and tell HMRC its a business expense but the warranty provider that its a personal purchase but that's fraud that can result in jail time.

penguineater

Sandtree said:

Not grey at all and works because most people aren't willing to go to jail over a TV.

Your statutory rights are defined by the entity buying it... your company buys it then its a B2B contract and so CRA doesn't apply, though the SoGA may apply as it hasn't been repealed for the limited protections it provides to vSMEs

Any warranties etc above and beyond your statutory rights all come down to the T&Cs which may differentiate between B2C and B2B sales. Note that businesses are not always worse, on a recent thread here someone didn't get a loan item whilst theirs was repaired as this clause was limited to B2B sales and not consumers. 

Yes you can lie and tell HMRC its a business expense but the warranty provider that its a personal purchase but that's fraud that can result in jail time.

Thanks for the info, I really appreciate it.

sheramber

You may fond there is a term in the warranty paperwork excluding business use.

Grumpy_chap

penguineater said:

unholyangel said:

penguineater said:

user1977 said:

Consumer rights are (as the name suggests) only for consumers. As soon as you become a business then the law assumes you're able to use your commercial clout and vast legal team in order to negotiate suitable terms (or at least understand the risks you're taking).

That's a shame.. I guess I could walk into a different retailer in-person and buy it with my business card and if any issues years later, just say i'm a consumer and make a claim within the 5 year warranty.

Surely if youre going to commit fraud, it should at least be for something worth the potential custodial sentence.

Btw, they can tell the card is commercial or not just from the card number. Because businesses can be charged extra depending on payment type, while consumers can't be.

shiraz99 said:

Are you genuinely going to be using the TV for your business or are you hoping to purchase it and, for example reclaim the VAT?

It's a genuine business cost that will be used every day for my work PC screen 

This is why a business transaction has different warranty. Your use profile will not match that of a consumer, both in terms of "on time" and increased potential for screen burn.

FWIW, TVs don't make good monitors.

penguineater

Grumpy_chap said:

penguineater said:

unholyangel said:

penguineater said:

user1977 said:

Consumer rights are (as the name suggests) only for consumers. As soon as you become a business then the law assumes you're able to use your commercial clout and vast legal team in order to negotiate suitable terms (or at least understand the risks you're taking).

That's a shame.. I guess I could walk into a different retailer in-person and buy it with my business card and if any issues years later, just say i'm a consumer and make a claim within the 5 year warranty.

Surely if youre going to commit fraud, it should at least be for something worth the potential custodial sentence.

Btw, they can tell the card is commercial or not just from the card number. Because businesses can be charged extra depending on payment type, while consumers can't be.

shiraz99 said:

Are you genuinely going to be using the TV for your business or are you hoping to purchase it and, for example reclaim the VAT?

It's a genuine business cost that will be used every day for my work PC screen 

This is why a business transaction has different warranty. Your use profile will not match that of a consumer, both in terms of "on time" and increased potential for screen burn.

FWIW, TVs don't make good monitors.

These past few years TVs have become very popular as monitors, 42" 4K HDR makes multitasking much much easier which increases work efficiency, not to mention the crystal clear text - I really recommend giving them a try to everyone that uses a PC for personal or work.

LED TVs are rated for 40,000-100,000 hours according to a quick Google search, 12 hours per day would make it 9-23 years. People will replace them for new models long before they are due to fail.

LG's OLED claim 30,000 hours which is 6.8 years at 12h per day.

If they cannot make TVs that last they should re-think their materials or introduce a power on and year warranty similar to how cars have year and mileage.