issue with saniflo & apparently incompetant plumber

Inigo_Montoya

My mother has been having problems with her saniflo 

the first issue was around spring 2021 when the pump would not turn off 

she had to call round 5 plumbers before she found one about 30 miles away willing to work with saniflos
- she was correctly advised to remove the fuse to stop the saniflo from pumping until the plumber came

the plumber than came but as the saniflo pumping issue had disappeared he did not do any actual work
( including any remedial work such as a service of the macerator for example )

He said he still had to charge his £120 call out fee but also said that he would not charge it next time if he
was needed again - my mother paid this charge 

Just recently (about a year later) the saniflo started having the same problem so we got the same plumber
to come out & sort it out

This time he told my mother that the vertical waste pipe had "dropped down" & this was the
reason the pump was not stopping - so all he did was slide the waste pipe up a couple of inches & 
told my mother the problem was fixed - again no other work was done e.g. an inspection or service
of the macerator for example

My mother reminded him about his promise of no second call out but he insisted she still had to pay 
another £120 - she paid this by cheque

However when I visited my mother later the same day I found the problem had not been fixed at all

I decided to look into the problem myself (I have some fairly basic plumbing DIY skills) and almost
immediately found that the problem was actually with the non return valve in the macerator outlet
which was sticking shut when it should be open

This faulty valve was the cause of the pump not stopping & when the plumber moved the waste pipe up
this caused it to temporarily to become unstuck but only for a single flush - hence him incorrectly saying the
waste pipe was the problem

Given all the above I have placed a stop in the 2nd £120 cheque 

I would be interested to hear peoples opinions as to whether they consider that to be a reasonable
thing to have done & how I should proceed from this point on when the plumber contacts us asking why the
cheque bounced 

Ganga

Can you not contact him and explain what you have done and the reason why.

Inigo_Montoya

Ganga said:

Can you not contact him and explain what you have done and the reason why.

I could do that but its not going to be a comfortable conversion given what has occurred & how we feel he has gone back on his word about the 2nd call out fee & been incompetent in incorrectly claiming to have fixed the fault ( possibly deliberately so IMO ) - I'd rather wait for him to contact us

Its not even as if we want him to come back again - apart from having no trust in him now - I also now know exactly what part needs replacing & how to change it (10 minute job)

If he had actually fixed the fault then we would have had no issue in paying the 2nd £120 but he didn't & wasnt able to identify a basic fault I found in 5 minutes myself

If he threatens the small claims court I will probably offer half hsi fee just to save the hassle of having to defend the claim - not sure what would happen in the small claims court as everything is word of mouth but I will be keeping the faulty part as evidence

HHarry

That’s not really fair is it?  Stopping his cheque because you’re not happy and waiting for him to get a letter from the bank before he knows there’s a problem.

When the Plumber offered to waive his fee, this would have been a fair offer if the problem had reappeared in days or weeks.  But it’s run with no problems for a year and I think charging another call out fee was reasonable.

I accept that he may not have fixed it, but he did what he thought was necessary, tested it and found it to be working at the point he asked for payment.  That doesn’t strike me as incompetent.  Not giving him the chance to put things right is out of order and given the trouble you had getting a Plumber the first time leaves you with the hassle of sorting it out if you have a bigger issue next time.

flashg67

My own opinion is that it's unreasonable to expect a free call out 12 months later, after a year of fault free running. He may have said it, but whether a court, for example, could consider you holding him to it is 'reasonable' is debateable. I do think you should tell him you've stopped the cheque - he'll be even more annoyed when the bank tell him - I would be furious regardless of the circumstances. I get that you're annoyed - I would be, but two wrongs don't make a right. Looks like you're now your Mums unofficial saniflow expert - it seems likely you'll have a problem finding another!

Inigo_Montoya

There are some assumptions in the last two replies that are not correct & some opinions that I don't agree with but I am happy to listen to nevertheless - to be frank those replies sound like they might be replies from trades people who would have a natural bias

I don't really have the time & energy to explain myself further right now (eg those incorrect assumptions) BUT as a consequence of what I've read I will be writing a letter to the plumber explaining why I have stopped the cheque rather than waiting for him to find out from the bank

Ms_Chocaholic

Will the plumber be charged if he presents a cheque to his bank that subsequently bounces.  This happened with me several years ago, the bank had accidentally cancelled a cheque and the recipient was charged (they did refund me as it was their error).  So not only will the plumber be wanting the £120 he will also be wanting the bank charge.

FaceHead

As Ms_Chocaholic says, the plumber will likely be charged a fee for banking the bounced check. If I was in his shoes that would make me furious.

Instead of discussing it like a grown up you don't want to have an "uncomfortable conversation" so have just stopped the cheque and left him having traveled a 60 mile round trip, with no payment, and being out of pocket for fuel and the banking charges.

If you were going to fix it yourself you should have done this before getting a plumber. If you're not going to fix it yourself, and the plumber's fix doesn't work, you should have asked him to come back and complete the job. 

If his fix doesn't work, but you have now overnight developed the skills to solve it yourself, then by all means fix it, and try to negotiate a partial refund for saving him the return trip. Don't just stop the cheque. 

I fully expect him to send you the letter before action for the banking fee plus £120, and then a court claim if necessary. If it went to court, he'd win, costing you yet more fees - you've written a cheque acknowledging the debt, and you've failed to make good on the debt. 

Ring him and have have that uncomfortable conversation, before you're having it in front of a judge. 

HHarry

I am a Tradesperson, so I accept your comment that I may have a bias.  Equally I may just be giving you the other point of view to consider.

What I don’t understand are the assumptions that I and Flash are supposed to have made that are incorrect.

My main point of contention is still the fact you’re stopping the cheque without warning, expecting him to contact you.  How would you feel if your wages just didn’t turn up one month?