Buy Capital Gearing Trust?

masonic

aroominyork said:

masonic said:

k_man said:

Clear as 😁

It's not unusual for such breakdowns to be wildly inaccurate, especially when dealing with different asset classes / holdings that include other funds, etc. It pays to go back to the fund prospectus / annual reports to get the full picture.

But to work through the list of equity holdings and their geography is a long task. The fund manager's approximation is good enough for me, especially when the bottom line is 'mostly UK '.

YMMV. PNL has fewer than 20 equity holdings. Many providers (including PNL) give you their own geographic analysis, which (assuming they understand the underlying investments they are holding) will be more reliable than those automated ones that feed in to the likes of HL, Trustnet, etc. I've not come across one where I couldn't get to the bottom of it within about 5 minutes, so far at least.

Separating out the REITs from the other equities (if you are inclined to do so) is probably the most difficult aspect, as I've found with CGT.

k_man

aroominyork said:

masonic said:

k_man said:

Clear as 😁

It's not unusual for such breakdowns to be wildly inaccurate, especially when dealing with different asset classes / holdings that include other funds, etc. It pays to go back to the fund prospectus / annual reports to get the full picture.

But to work through the list of equity holdings and their geography is a long task. The fund manager's approximation is good enough for me, especially when the bottom line is 'mostly UK '.

Not sure about use of the term mostly UK but PNL has more of a US bias, and CGT more UK bias.

mears1

Apologies for a basic question about this wealth preservation funds. Why do people include CGT, PNL and Ruffer Investment Trust and RIT capital Partners into their Portfolio when the returns are so low when comparing these on Trustnet with a Global tracker? Some of the management fees are quite high for so little gain!

masonic

mears1 said:

Apologies for a basic question about this wealth preservation funds. Why do people include CGT, PNL and Ruffer Investment Trust and RIT capital Partners into their Portfolio when the returns are so low when comparing these on Trustnet with a Global tracker? Some of the management fees are quite high for so little gain!

Perhaps you need to adjust the time axis.

During the troubled times of 2001-2011, CGT managed to triple its value in a decade where a global index fund would have returned less than a UK savings account. In the bull market of the next decade, global equities closed the gap somewhat. Who knows whether 2021-2031 will be more like the first or second period.

eskbanker

mears1 said:

Apologies for a basic question about this wealth preservation funds. Why do people include CGT, PNL and Ruffer Investment Trust and RIT capital Partners into their Portfolio when the returns are so low when comparing these on Trustnet with a Global tracker? Some of the management fees are quite high for so little gain!

The clue is in the name - these products are aimed at preserving wealth (relative to inflation) rather than growing it (but with higher risk of loss), and so are typically more suited to the decumulation rather than accumulation phase of the investment lifecycle.  Horses for courses, investment isn't all about seeking maximum returns, given the risks associated with that approach....

Aminatidi

mears1 said:

Apologies for a basic question about this wealth preservation funds. Why do people include CGT, PNL and Ruffer Investment Trust and RIT capital Partners into their Portfolio when the returns are so low when comparing these on Trustnet with a Global tracker? Some of the management fees are quite high for so little gain!

Masonic's graph gives a very easy to understand example.

Short term and recently you couldn't really go wrong being in 100% equities.

Longer term they will experience downturns and some people don't want that or just don't like it so will accept a little less on the upside in return for hopefully avoiding those occasional 20-30% dips on the downside.

I have a big allocation to Capital Gearing Trust and Ruffer and right now I'm much more comfortable with that all-weather approach than I am counting entirely on a global tracker.

Of course depending on your timescales a global tracker could be the right option too.

coastline

Yesterday..45 minutes with Peter Spiller

Peter Spiller: The bear waiting for the big crash and a bull market - Citywire

m_c_s

Thanks for the podcast link.

It's amazing that Peter Spiller has been managing Capital Gearing Trust for 40 years and his track record is quite impressive for a wealth preserving fund returning 200x since 1982.
Very interesting listening to him especially his experience of the 70s and early 80s with very high inflation and being Volckered (US Fed Chair) in the 70s and the tough high interest rate approach taken to bringing down inflation.  
It's also great to get a deep insight into CGTs current portfolio and the approach he has taken to bonds and especially index linked bonds;  primarily US TIPs and short duration UK index linked bonds.

aroominyork

m_c_s said:

It's amazing that Peter Spiller has been managing Capital Gearing Trust for 40 years and his track record is quite impressive for a wealth preserving fund returning 200x since 1982.

Also pretty impressive compared to global equities. (Trustnet charting only shows from 1995.)

aroominyork

This week I sold my CGAR (Acc) holdings and bought CGT. I then noticed a hidden cost in the difference between these two funds which I had not considered. Next week CGT goes ex-dividend so, if I reinvest the income in CGT, I will pay the spread and stamp duty on the amount of my holding which I essentially have to re-buy. It's not tragic but it's something to be aware of.