New Gas Boiler

Zandoni

I'd only replace the boiler if you want to move it to the loft, however old it is a new boiler will never pay for itself.

BUFF

but a new boiler + new controls all properly set up & used might (mine has over it's 13 year life so far & I reckon that the latest controls could probably eke out another 10% saving in gas usage) depending upon what was already fitted.

Mineral1

How have you worked that out?

Bear in mind over 13 years your current boilers efficiency will have dropped hugely from the quoted figures when new.

BUFF

went from a balanced flue boiler with programmer+TRVs but no roomstat to a condensing fan-flued one with programmer+roomstat+TRVs. Better control also allowed for changes in behaviour> less gas consumed. My last 12 month's gas usage (I know that it's anomalous as it's been a particularly mild winter) is 1/3 of what it was back in the 2000s, generally it's just under 1/2 or a saving of > 8000kWh p.a.
I don't believe that my boiler's efficiency will have dropped "hugely", significant perhaps but not huge.

I could go further than that if you were to also take into account a potential repairs bill on the old boiler as a saving plus a grant & interest free loan that I got to replace it (& the interest that I earned by sticking that into an ISA for the period of the loan).

Certainly the next boiler+controls upgrade here has no chance of replicating this return.

Zandoni

BUFF said:

but a new boiler + new controls all properly set up & used might (mine has over it's 13 year life so far & I reckon that the latest controls could probably eke out another 10% saving in gas usage) depending upon what was already fitted.

You can use the latest controls like Hive or Nest with an old boiler, a new boiler can never pay for itself in gas useage, it will need replacing again well before it get's the chance.

In my experience people seem to take out service contracts so repair bills don't really come into the equation.

Mstty

@BUFF @Brewer21 @matelodave

For us ASHP is now cheaper to run than gas. Our previous 3 bed link detached house heated to the same temps and using all the same gadgets would, under the new price capped rates, come out to £2359. Our current projection for our new house is £2132

To compare both houses were high B's and both under 6 years old and the 4 bed house here the ASHP was put in with the house build

Obviously this is for us and I do accept retro fitting does comes with some issues with bigger radiators required and you generally don't retro fit underfloor heating so that has to be taken into consideration.

Still, for a much bigger house (1.5x bigger) but same EPC rating ASHP is a 9% saving.

Reed_Richards

I looked up a SVR tariff.  It was 7.336p per kWh for gas and 27.838p per kWh for electricity.  Assuming your gas boiler operates with 90% average efficiency you would need a heat pump to operate with about 340% average efficiency to equal the running cost.  A GSHP might manage that or an ASHP supplying underfloor heating only but ti is probably slightly beyond the reach of an ASHP running radiators.  Heat pumps are indeed hugely expensive to install compared to a gas boiler but these days their running costs are quite close to what you would achieve with gas.       

Mstty

Real life, real situation comparison or theoretical for someone using a calculator.

For us the tipping point has happened. Don't forget the extra £90 gas SC that makes up a lot of the saving we talk about in the 9% we have made.

BUFF

Zandoni said:

BUFF said:

but a new boiler + new controls all properly set up & used might (mine has over it's 13 year life so far & I reckon that the latest controls could probably eke out another 10% saving in gas usage) depending upon what was already fitted.

You can use the latest controls like Hive or Nest with an old boiler, a new boiler can never pay for itself in gas useage, it will need replacing again well before it get's the chance.

In my experience people seem to take out service contracts so repair bills don't really come into the equation.

Yes, but it is unlikely that the energy savings would pay for the cost of fitting the latest controls at this stage in this boiler's life before it needs replaced. Hive or Nest don't really give me much over what I have now (e.g. neither will.do bus level communication with my Worcester boiler) & tbh I would be unlikely to go with either of those brands anyway.
If e.g. I go with Worcester branded controls (which are no dearer) fitted at the same time as a new Worcester boiler then not only would I get bus level communication but they are also guaranteed for the same length as the boiler (could be up to 12 years) subject to the usual requirements to maintain the boiler guarantee.

I didn't say that a new boiler could pay for itself over it's life, I said "a new boiler + new controls all properly set up & used might" & so they have done in my case, I attribute a large part of that to the controls. I have also said my next upgrade won't - it depends where you are coming from to start.

Service contracts that include "no additional cost" repairs have already figured in the likely cost of any repairs otherwise the companies go bust (or they have a get out clause). My boiler has needed no repairs in it's 13 years, at this stage in it's life any required repairs would likely influence a repair/replace decision depending upon cost.

BUFF

Mstty said:

@BUFF @Brewer21 @matelodave

For us ASHP is now cheaper to run than gas. Our previous 3 bed link detached house heated to the same temps and using all the same gadgets would, under the new price capped rates, come out to £2359. Our current projection for our new house is £2132

Good for you & I am glad that it works for you.
It's unlikely to be a solution for me as I live in a row of terraced houses in a Conservation Area.
I already have larger sized radiators though which is 1 reason why I can run low flow/return temps on my boiler to max. efficiency.

As a comparison at current SVR rates my projected annual gas bill (for a normal year not the very mild last year) will be <£700.