Help with buying house. Basement WC is outside title plan

taklamakan

Hi, I am buying a terraced house. The house has three floors (basement, ground and 1st floor). My offer was accepted but I spotted a problem. Basically, the basement WC is located outside the title plan. The current owner is saying the WC was already there when he bought the house 12 years ago, however I found the old floorplan and the WC wasn't there, so I assume the WC must have been added by the current owner. See attached photo. Would this be a problem? Will I still be able to purchase this house in it's current state?

user1977

Are you buying with a mortgage? If so then it will probably be a problem (if your solicitor is aware). Though worst case scenario is only that the neighbour evicts you from your basement bog.

taklamakan

Yes with mortgage. But my deposit is 55%

user1977

taklamakan said:

Yes with mortgage. But my deposit is 55%

Doesn't matter. Standard instructions from the lender to the solicitor are to make sure you are buying everything occupied by the house. Might be able to get indemnity insurance to cover the risk, though would help if the vendor wasn't lying about when it was done...

Anyway, best talk to your solicitor to check that your interpretation is correct and to see how best to handle it.

canaldumidi

It's a terraced house, so presumably there is a neighbour right up against/adjoined to your right-hand boundary. So what does the neighbour's title plan show?

Ramouth

Could it have been missed by the previous agent?  Does it look newish?  Or dated?

eddddy

taklamakan said:

 The current owner is saying the WC was already there when he bought the house 12 years ago, however I found the old floorplan and the WC wasn't there, so I assume the WC must have been added by the current owner.

Is that an estate agent's floorplan? If not, where did it come from?

I wouldn't rely on an estate agent's floorplan  as conclusive evidence that the WC wasn't there 12 years ago. 

It could either be that the estate agent didn't know it was there and/or they left it off the floorplan to try to avoid difficult questions.



TBH, it seems incredibly unlikely that the current owner would have cut through an external wall and excavated under the neighbour's alleyway in order to install a basement WC.

Although I guess it could have been a storage cupboard which has been converted to a WC.

Is it a very old property? If so, I'd suspect it was just one of the 'strange' things builders did many years ago. (Maybe because the whole terrace was owned by one person - and the boundaries between the properties were devised later.) Does the neighbour have a similar WC arrangement under the other part of the alley?


If it seems like the WC / Cupboard has been there since the property was built - I might think carefully about pros and cons of mentioning it to my solicitor.

theoretica

I wonder if it used to be a coal shed.  Can you find plans of any other houses in the area which are similarly next to alleyways?

taklamakan

canaldumidi said:

It's a terraced house, so presumably there is a neighbour right up against/adjoined to your right-hand boundary. So what does the neighbour's title plan show?

The neighbour's title plan shows a straight line. I checked other neighbours floorplans and they don't have toilets there, only my one does.

Ramouth said:

Could it have been missed by the previous agent?  Does it look newish?  Or dated?

It could have been misses by previous agent on purpose or it actually wasn't there. That's the whole mystery. 

eddddy said:

TBH, it seems incredibly unlikely that the current owner would have cut through an external wall and excavated under the neighbour's alleyway in order to install a basement WC.

Although I guess it could have been a storage cupboard which has been converted to a WC.

Is it a very old property? If so, I'd suspect it was just one of the 'strange' things builders did many years ago. (Maybe because the whole terrace was owned by one person - and the boundaries between the properties were devised later.) Does the neighbour have a similar WC arrangement under the other part of the alley?


If it seems like the WC / Cupboard has been there since the property was built - I might think carefully about pros and cons of mentioning it to my solicitor.

Yes, I know where you coming from. It could have been a storage cupboard that was converted to a WC.

Yes it's old, it was built in 1850s. Neighbour doesn't have a similar arrangement.



I checked the title plan and it clearly shows the land where the WC is belongs to the house next door, however there is an interesting note in the land register which says that I have "a right of way at all times and for all purposes over and along the alleyway and the right to connect with and use all drains and sewers laid thereunder". Does this actually mean the toilet can be there? So there is no problem?

user1977

taklamakan said:

I checked the title plan and it clearly shows the land where the WC is belongs to the house next door, however there is an interesting note in the land register which says that I have "a right of way at all times and for all purposes over and along the alleyway and the right to connect with and use all drains and sewers laid thereunder". Does this actually mean the toilet can be there?

How do you make that out? It means you have a right of way over the alleyway, and a right to connect into the drains under the alleyway. Nothing to do with occupying a room under the alleyway.

Doozergirl

You've got a bit of a 'flying freehold' situation.  I'm sure the space will have always been there in some form.  

It probably needs an indemnity policy.  It's not massive and it probably won't affect the mortgage but it might mean a bit of extra work for your solicitor.  

That toilet will probably be a macerator so be careful what you put in it.