End of Tenancy Deposit Dispute & unclear Outstanding Utility Bill

Mahsroh

Schwarzwald said:

Mahsroh said:

I don't see your argument on the water bill though. You knew the intention was the letting agent to invoice you periodically so surely you knew this was going to catch up with you at some point. If it was me and I hadn't received it after 3 months or so I would've given the LA a nudge, knowing full well that if I didn't, I would lead to this scenario later down the line. 

I know the argument is weak, I am just using it as a potential negotiation chip.

The honest truth on the billing is though, that yes I was always confused why I never had to register anywhere and no bills were coming, but I had a busy life and other things to take care of. And from a pure cash flow perspective, I am better off settling the accrued amount now vs over the last 7 years ... that's why I was never keen to investigate it, just no upside.

I would just deal with the two issues in isolation to be honest. Pay the water bill, as you should, and if you don't get a satisfactory response on the proposed deductions following the check out then raise a dispute with the deposit scheme, where I think (with the limited info) you probably have a strong case). 

I've never been involved in a deposit dispute, either as a LL or Tenant so I don't know if if would have any relevance, but in other industries someone adjudicating on a dispute would take the behaviour of the parties into account, and I don't think your stance on the water bill would go down well.

HampshireH

The water bill is seperate to your deposit 

Don't pay it and face the possibility of a CCJ.

Your deposit you can challenge. I would just put it straight through without delay or negotiation. They have already delayed its return and they will need to prove its reasonable deductions.

molerat

Of course they can send you a bill for something you were liable for during the contractual period,  I suspect if you don't pay it they will issue court proceedings. Unlikely there is any bargaining room for you there. 

What did you tenancy agreement state about responsibilities for utility bills ?

Schwarzwald

molerat said:

Of course they can send you a bill for something you were liable for during the contractual period,  I suspect if you don't pay it they will issue court proceedings. Unlikely there is any bargaining room for you there. 

What did you tenancy agreement state about responsibilities for utility bills ?

As mentioned in earlier posts, I don't actually plan to not pay the water bill. I used the water and therefore I am fine to pay it. I would obviously not risk any credit mark or CCJ. 

I was primarily interested in the legal position on this matter given the set-up that the bill is not in my name and the tenancy agreement has now ended.

The TA states ... [the deposit can be used for] “any unpaid accounts … for utilities or water … for which the tenant is liable.” 
 
But consensus seems to be that I am liable, even if not the contractual counterparty, so probably proceeding as planned to settle the bill. While I will also formally request the deposit back tomorrow.

Thanks everyone.

canaldumidi

Schwarzwald said:

molerat said:

Of course they can send you a bill for something you were liable for during the contractual period,  I suspect if you don't pay it they will issue court proceedings. Unlikely there is any bargaining room for you there. 

What did you tenancy agreement state about responsibilities for utility bills ?

I was primarily interested in the legal position on this matter given the set-up that the bill is not in my name and the tenancy agreement has now ended.

The tenancy may have ended but that does not mean your contractual obligations end.
The TA states ... [the deposit can be used for] “any unpaid accounts … for utilities or water … for which the tenant is liable.” So pretty clear.
 
But consensus seems to be that I am liable, even if not the contractual counterparty, Not sure what that 2nd half means. You are liable 'full stop'.

 so probably proceeding as planned to settle the bill. While I will also formally request the deposit back tomorrow.

You may have no contractual obligation to the utility company, but you do have a contractual obligation to the landlord.

TripleH

Canaldumidi is correct. You have no legal responsibility or requirement to pay the utility provider for the hot water nor should you be subject to any direct sanctions should those bills not be paid.

Your only obligation would be to pass those bills on to the landlord (his appointed agents are an acceptable party in this case).

You also don't have to pay anything for the water until you receive a formal valid invoice (although making specific payments on account is a sensible option). If you are expecting  to be billed but haven't received anything, it does make sense to chase up asking for an invoice and setting an estimated sum aside each month to pay the bill.

Schwarzwald

To close the loop on this and provide reference for future readers, I pushed back hard on the general deductions for supposedly wear & tear.

Ultimately we settled on me paying 100% of the outstanding, not yet invoiced utility bill (as always intended) and 1/3 of the initial amount of deductions, i.e. negotiated them down quite a bit.

Feels like fair outcome and time to move on, but I would always propose to push back hard on the initial LL deductions, seems like they tend to rather put forward too many deductions than too little.

yksi

For any reading and having issues in future: the default position of the deposit protection schemes is that the renter gets the whole deposit back, unless the landlord files a claim to retain some. So it's in your interest to do it on the day you leave, and not delay, because if the landlord is slow/incompetent like the one in this thread, they'll probably miss the deadline to claim - as has happened to me in the past.

Thanks for updating the thread and glad it worked out well for you.