Neighbour keeps his refuse bins on my property

saajan_12

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

You need to be sensible with this one.  Firstly it's not 'your' house, it is the tenant's home until such time as his lease agreement comes to an end.  The tenant may not appreciate you stirring up trouble with his neighbour.  He's got to live there, don't forget; he doesn't have the luxury of being able to hop in his car and go somewhere else.  
Secondly, the property as described sounds rather like it might be a flying freehold.  Lots of buildings with access archways and so on are owned on such a basis.  Does your title deed include the road beneath the arch, or just the walls abutting it?  If so, your neighbours will have a right of access to the garages at the rear.  

wilfred30 said:

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

You need to be sensible with this one.  Firstly it's not 'your' house, it is the tenant's home until such time as his lease agreement comes to an end.  The tenant may not appreciate you stirring up trouble with his neighbour.  He's got to live there, don't forget; he doesn't have the luxury of being able to hop in his car and go somewhere else.  
Secondly, the property as described sounds rather like it might be a flying freehold.  Lots of buildings with access archways and so on are owned on such a basis.  Does your title deed include the road beneath the arch, or just the walls abutting it?  If so, your neighbours will have a right of access to the garages at the rear.  

Of course it's the OP's house.  It doesn't cease to belong to them just because it's rented out.

Having a right of access through to the garages doesn't give them the right to keep their 'items' in the access way.

Semantics of who's house it is aside, the relevant point is it is still the tenant's home. 

Is this area part of the tenancy? If so, what items are left in an area they rent is upto the tenant. Legally, if the tenant allowed their neighbour to keep bins there (whether explicitly or by just ignoring it), that's their choice and its nothing to do with the LL. 

Practically, even if its not on area rented by the tenant, I'd still give the choice to the tenant. They are the one that has to live with either the daily annoyance of someone's bins there, or the tension when the neighbour is annoyed. The LL has neither. Everyone saying stand up for yourself.. its really not hurting the LL at all. 

Slinky

If you could persuade the council to remove the bins, the neighbour will most likely just dump his rubbish under the carport, or worse, start making your tenant's life a misery. Flytipping on private land is the responsibility of the landowner to remove, so you don't want that to happen.

Annoying though it is, I'd let it ride if you're not living there yourself and it doesn't bother your tenant. The neighbour may move on and the problem could resolve itself.

SusieTiple

The problem you have is you are not their all of the time. If you were you could remove the bins and video and document any harassment from your neighbour for doing this.

Over period of time you would collect enough evidence to present to the police and get them to take action as harassment. This can lead to a anti social order been issued.

Section62

saajan_12 said:

Semantics of who's house it is aside, the relevant point is it is still the tenant's home. 

I think this is more than semantics.  A property owner is not relieved of all their legal obligations and rights just because they are letting the property out.  The issue is the extent to which the owner is responsible and/or retains a right to act.

saajan_12 said:

Is this area part of the tenancy? If so, what items are left in an area they rent is upto the tenant. Legally, if the tenant allowed their neighbour to keep bins there (whether explicitly or by just ignoring it), that's their choice and its nothing to do with the LL. 

This (BiB) is incorrect.  The tenant cannot allow the neighbour to keep bins on land and deposit waste in them if the land isn't part of the neighbour's curtilage and there is no 'legal' agreement (e.g. a 'designated place' within (say) a lease)  (both the tenant and neighbour would be committing an offence, albeit of a technical nature)

The issue is the extent to which the landlord might be responsible for preventing unlawful use of the land by the tenant and/or others.  I'd suggest that this is something a Court would agree the landlord has a legitimate interest in.

saajan_12 said:

Practically, even if its not on area rented by the tenant, I'd still give the choice to the tenant. They are the one that has to live with either the daily annoyance of someone's bins there, or the tension when the neighbour is annoyed. The LL has neither. Everyone saying stand up for yourself.. its really not hurting the LL at all. 

Practically, I'd agree.  On the other hand, as the property owner the OP may end up with an expensive problem without gaining any benefit from improved neighbourly relations... that's how the 'hurt' might happen.

AyJaydee

This seems to be an issue where there's nothing to gain by winning, but with each option I can only lose something. 
Also, you have all given me helpful suggestions and things to consider, which I appreciate, thank you; but I still cannot see a clear way through this dilemma?
It is a private housing estate. The neighbour owns his home.  The accessway is my land, not part of the public highway. I am the legal owner, I paid off the mortgage some time back. The accessway is more than wide enough for a car, and some. No, I can't make it narrower. The bins are owned by the council/refuse contractors.
At the time I made the purchase, my Conveyancing Solicitor said that this was a "most unusual" property.
I do not have a garden. On the site plan, my bin space is by my front door and butting up against my neighbours land. In fact, it goes slightly over the border and is the size of the manhole cover that straddles the border, in front of where my meter cabinet is mounted on the wall.  But that was when we just had one bin, now we had two bins and assorted boxes. Aside from the visual appearance of having bins on show by the front door, it would now be impossible to place my bins/boxes there because the neighbour has put up a low fence around his front garden, with a dog-leg around the manhole cover so that there is access to the meter cabinet. So my bins have to go underneath, there's nowhere else to put them.  I can see why he wants his bins where they are; he has done a makeover of his back garden and made it look very nice, bins would spoil the appearance.

I think that I am going to have to have another chat with my insurers legal helpline, to find out where I stand legally.  I shall also approach the council and talk to them about where the bins should go? But I am not expecting them to show any interest in being involved.
Any other thoughts, please?

theoretica

So you/your tenant keeps your bins in the archway?  If I am reading that correctly, then it pretty much makes it impossible for you to invoke any arguments about bins there being a fire risk.

YoungBlueEyes

I would try to diffuse the situation with a little humour (assuming your tenants are also unhappy about the bins being there). I would leave a note saying something like "You keep leaving your bins on my property so from Monday 24th I shall begin to use them as my own. I produce incredible amounts of rubbish so this is great news for me!"

Slithery

Have your tenants actually mentioned any issue to you? If not then I'd just keep quiet as it's not really any of your business and anything you do may end up having negative consequences in some way.

Mildreds_Earrings

Honestly, I would be annoyed if I lived there and would tackle the bully neighbours (with my husband, Dad & brothers - I hate bullies) but if I didn't live there, I wouldn't be as bothered. As others have mentioned, what do your tenants want?

I'm sorry the neighbour and his wife verbally attacked you after your very reasonable request but there are some vermin mascerading as humans and some things just aren't worth it, especially if you don't live there. 

Regarding your further question about selling/keeping the property, well as a divorcee myself, I would keep the property, as sadly, marriages do break up. Don't sell your property because of where some selfish cretins choose to put their bins. All the best. 

Ditzy_Mitzy

Section62 said:

saajan_12 said:

Semantics of who's house it is aside, the relevant point is it is still the tenant's home. 

I think this is more than semantics.  A property owner is not relieved of all their legal obligations and rights just because they are letting the property out.  The issue is the extent to which the owner is responsible and/or retains a right to act.

saajan_12 said:

Is this area part of the tenancy? If so, what items are left in an area they rent is upto the tenant. Legally, if the tenant allowed their neighbour to keep bins there (whether explicitly or by just ignoring it), that's their choice and its nothing to do with the LL. 

This (BiB) is incorrect.  The tenant cannot allow the neighbour to keep bins on land and deposit waste in them if the land isn't part of the neighbour's curtilage and there is no 'legal' agreement (e.g. a 'designated place' within (say) a lease)  (both the tenant and neighbour would be committing an offence, albeit of a technical nature)

The issue is the extent to which the landlord might be responsible for preventing unlawful use of the land by the tenant and/or others.  I'd suggest that this is something a Court would agree the landlord has a legitimate interest in.

saajan_12 said:

Practically, even if its not on area rented by the tenant, I'd still give the choice to the tenant. They are the one that has to live with either the daily annoyance of someone's bins there, or the tension when the neighbour is annoyed. The LL has neither. Everyone saying stand up for yourself.. its really not hurting the LL at all. 

Practically, I'd agree.  On the other hand, as the property owner the OP may end up with an expensive problem without gaining any benefit from improved neighbourly relations... that's how the 'hurt' might happen.

@Section62

What offence do you believe will be, or is being, committed?  Genuinely interested.