Heathrow T5 Drop off Zone APCOA Parking

Coupon-mad

I'd still add the belt and braces of the other template POPLA paras from the 3rd post of the NEWBIES thread.

Umkomaas

Simple case of copying and pasting the other already written appeal points from the NEWBIES FAQ Announcement, third post, checking it over to ensure it 'sits' with your APCOA case, giving them a sh*tstorm of appeal points to deal with, enhancing the potential for them throwing in their cards and slinking away.

30 minute job. 

TRIO74

im afraid that i already submitted it as per my post. do you think this will not win then.

Coupon-mad

It should win.

Umkomaas

TRIO74 said:

im afraid that i already submitted it as per my post. do you think this will not win then.

No, not necessarily as you've got the key point nailed. You've just got to hope you don't get an Assessor who doesn't understand PoFA and byelaws. Even if you 'lose', you don't pay, APCOA is unlikely to do anything much further. Maybe some silly debt collector letters which can be ignored until they drift away. 

TRIO74

Hi All

I got an email yesterday from POPLA, which considering i have not paid them means that they
have canceled the parking charge.

Many thanks for all your help

Dear Mr XXXXXX

The operator has contacted us and told us that they have withdrawn your appeal.

If you have already paid your parking charge, this is the reason your appeal will have been withdrawn. Unfortunately, you cannot pay your parking charge and appeal, which means that POPLA’s involvement in your appeal has ended. You will not be able to request a refund of the amount paid in order to resubmit your appeal to us.

If you have not paid your parking charge, the operator has reviewed your appeal and chosen to cancel the parking charge. As the operator has withdrawn your appeal, POPLA’s involvement has now ended and you do not need to take any further action.

Kind regards

POPLA Team

Jenni_D

Easiest way to check is to go online and pretend you want to pay the PCN - when you enter the PCN reference it should come back as not found or with £0 balance owing.  

Coupon-mad

Well done: PCN cancelled!  Easy v APCOA!

stonechat

Bob__M said:

Hi

Appeal Success – T5 Drop Off Zone - POPLA ACPOA

First time post on MSE but want to share my blissful happiness after defeating an £80 PCN from ACPOA regarding the Heathrow T5 Drop-off zone in the hope that it helps others avoid ACPOA's gouging practices.

Scenario: mistakenly drove through Drop-off Zone (DOZ) whilst attempting to find Meet & Greet (MnG) hand-over point.

Phase 1: Issued with £40 PCN which I appealed on grounds of 1) didn't make a drop-off as we drove straight through 2) I had MnG booked and offered to provide  proof  3) I suggest that ACPOA review their ANPR timestamps to see that I could not possibly have dropped anyone from the car in the time difference between entry and exit 4) no safe or legal alternative in T5 1-way system.

Phase 2: ACPOA summarily reject my appeal.  They ignore my comments on timestamp data and they claim that they had requested proof of MnG and that I had not responded.

Phase 3: I appeal to POPLA on grounds of:

1) The name “Drop-off Zone” implies fee is charged for dropping off but does not say what happens if you drive straight through.  All signs talk about Parking Charge Notices (PCNs) but when you drive through you don’t ever stop so the driver is a) unable to read the detailed Ts&Cs posted along the DOZ (according to ACPOA)  and  2) never enters into a contract to park.

2) ACPOA had ignored my request for timestamp data

3) No safe or legal alternative in 1-way system if you miss the turn

4) I supplied proof of MnG booking which, as far as I was concerned, ACPOA had not requested.

Phase 4: ACPOA respond to POPLA request for their evidence.

Over a 31 page document (!!!) ACPOA mostly just repeat everything that had gone before with 2 exceptions:

1) They show images of some of their road signs

2) they offer timestamp data that is rounded to the nearest minute and shows an interval of 2 minutes e.g. 07:40 and 07:42.

Phase 5: I offer comments on ACPOA’s evidence.

1) Signage offered as evidence is all about “PCNs” and “parking”. ACPOA have not shown signs of “DOZ” which, as name implies, is all about dropping-off, not driving straight through.  Since I did not “park” or “drop-off” then the signs were incomplete and misleading in respect of charges.

2) Time stamp data is misleading and incomplete. I calculated that driving through the 450 mt long drop off zone at an avg. speed of 15mph (there's a 20 mph limit with multiple raised pedestrian crossings) will take over a minute (1’ 7”).  I also showed that the shortest possible interval between the 2 timestamps (rounded to the nearest minute) was 1 minute 1 second.  So proving that I could not have “dropped-off”.

3) ACPOA offered no proof of sending or delivery of their request to me for proof of MnG booking

4) I asked the open questions:… why would I use DOZ why I had MnG booked and was early for flight?  And why would I ignore a request for proof of MnG booking if it was crucial for my appeal?

Phase 6  I win my appeal on grounds of incomplete/misleading signage and on timestamp calculations proving I did not stop.  POPLA did not comment on other points as case decided by the first points.

Hope this helps.

 

 

ooh, we did exactly the same as your scenario.  I'm now busily researching.

I could also point out that there were two people in the car on entry and exit, so who was being dropped off. 

I wonder if I should put all my evidence into the 1st appeal, I have my booking with the meet and greet service. 

Question to more experienced forumites, the car meet & greet service also has my name on it, should I redact that in the copy?  It will still have the car reg. on it.

many thanks

Coupon-mad

 wonder if I should put all my evidence into the 1st appeal, I have my booking with the meet and greet service.  

You don't need to do any of this. POPLA shouldn't be needed.

It is the simplest one to kill off with one appeal from the keeper - just use the NEWBIES thread template appeal and add ONE LINE telling them to get lost due to it being non-POFA.

All the stuff you are wanting to add is not only over-thinking it, but puts you in danger of blowing your winning point by blabbing who was driving.

This is so easy. Don't blow your toes off as keeper by implying who was driving.