Horizon PCN - Changed wording on letter?

BizzyBeez

Hi

I have a similar situation to the one in this thread at the same location Parking charge notice (PCN), Horizon, Iceland Chester - store closed and fine still issued! — MoneySavingExpert Forum-

I have received the attached (as vehicle keeper). I was stopped in the same car park for approx. 30 mins (approx. 9pm) and never left the vehicle due to collecting someone from work, with my intention of doing some shopping whilst I waited before realising the store was closed so I ended up just sitting and waiting, and wrongly assumed parking would be free as the store was closed, so no way to get validation of stay nor pay. Camera stills show the vehicle entering and leaving but not the driver as it was dark.

I have noted however that the wording on my PCN is different to the one on the above thread notably the last paragraph which now references POFA and keeper liability - am I able to contest this on the basis of driver not identifiable, nor were able to pay?? 

Thanks in advance

Biz

Umkomaas

That doesn't contain the prescribed wording of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4) para 9.

Can we also see a redacted copy of the front of the letter - please leave all dates showing. 

Coupon-mad

The vague phrase ''full payment or driver details'' as well as ''if after 28 days'' (which is wrong and unclear when the time starts) has been held by POPLA not to be POFA compliant before.  Premier Park used to use that sentence and lost quite a few POPLA appeals about it.

Coupon-mad

I have received the attached over the weekend (as vehicle keeper). I was stopped in the same car park for approx. 30 mins (approx. 9pm) and never left the vehicle due to collecting someone from work, with my intention of doing some shopping whilst I waited before realising the store was closed so I ended up just sitting and waiting, and wrongly assumed parking would be free as the store was closed, so no way to get validation of stay nor pay. Camera stills show the vehicle entering and leaving but not the driver as it was dark.

Not a great move. 

Advice for next time:  Park on a side road.  I have no idea why people wait anywhere except on street.  You had no reason to drive into nor even look for a car park.  I never use a private car park at night.  Any street would do, even a double yellow as long as not causing any obstruction, is OK to board passengers.  Perfectly legal, that's what double yellows are for.

https://goo.gl/maps/NrXuu9k43kmeaJ3Q8

The pedestrian zone is only applicable until 4.30pm so that's the sort of street to park in, no PCN risk. 

Interesting to see that image also shows the Iceland car park has no Entrance sign from Horizon.  A specific breach of the 'mandatory entrance signs' requirements of the BPA CoP.  Use it for POPLA stage but no implying who parked.

BizzyBeez

Umkomaas said:

That doesn't contain the prescribed wording of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4) para 9.

Does this mean I should submit an appeal on the grounds of POFA with non-driver disclosure? (Blue section newbies thread?)

Umkomaas

BizzyBeez said:

Umkomaas said:

That doesn't contain the prescribed wording of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4) para 9.

Does this mean I should submit an appeal on the grounds of POFA with non-driver disclosure?

Let's see the front page of the NtK to check out the dates first. They may help you firmly nail this. 

Coupon-mad

BizzyBeez said:

Umkomaas said:

That doesn't contain the prescribed wording of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4) para 9.

Does this mean I should submit an appeal on the grounds of POFA with non-driver disclosure? (Blue section newbies thread?)

I already made that clear.  Yes, that will be one of your points for POPLA.

BizzyBeez

Umkomaas said:

Let's see the front page of the NtK to check out the dates first. They may help you firmly nail this. 

PCN Date - 19th Nov
Parking Charge Details - Issue Date - 26th Nov
Received in Post - 30th Nov

BizzyBeez

Fruitcake said:

Okay, so the NTK failed PoFA on wording but not dates.

Send the appeal template in blue text from the NEWBIES, and add a one liner that the NTK does not contain the mandatory PoFA wording therefore the keeper cannot be held liable.

Thank you - much appreciated. Will update here how it goes.....

Out interest, what should the mandatory wording say, as opposed to what I received?

Coupon-mad

The NEWBIES thread already links to the Pofa schedule 4 'for those who want to dig deeper' and understand keeper liability.

D_P_Dance

You need to take this seriouly and put in the hours, these companies ruin lives. Watch this

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p067bmlh