Subsidence - Help Dealing with Insurance Company & what are appropriate Investigation types??

[Deleted User]

Hi,  I would be really grateful for your opinions re the following subsidence issue:  sorry long post!

HISTORY

• My father bought his semi-detached bungalow in 1963 from a local builder.  Sandy soil, build on a 1920s cherry orchard.  I think its fair to say my father & neighbours have all concluded over the years that a master builder was not at work.  Eg Across the back of the property there is a decided slope and it has been questioned as to whether an extra/missing brick course issue is across the back of Dad's house & also further across adjoining property.
• In 1988 when Dad was having the property doubleglazed, the bricklayer could not get down to firm foundations under the lounge window (new wall was replacing old cedarboard).  Dad contacted his then insurance (Coop) questioning subsidence and Coop's appointed structural engineer concluded that the lounge floor had insufficient infrastructure(?) in the concrete.  This was all dug up/repaired & the double galzing fitted.  Interestingly, the Coop paid out on what (to me) seemed original 1963  builder error rather than an insured peril??  Subsidence was ruled out apparently (??) but Dad now 78 years was not the sort of person who would have challenged "professionals" unf.  I have located the Coop's SE who is still working locally and he has pulled his file from archive and I have an appt to see the file & discuss it with him.
• 6 months laterr in 1989, adjoining bungalow is bought by a builder who immediately has to have his bungalow underpinned (by Van Elle) at rear (close to Dad's) & also his central parallel internal wall.  (Now, I was a child then and sadly Dad did not go back to the Coop).  Builder still owns property (rents it out) but he has told me he continues to monitor it and it has moved nealy an inch in the 30 years.  From the naked eye, at the front, the two bungalows appear to be dropped in the middle.  Builder also tells me that he is aware that our two bungalows (in whole or  in part) had been built on the old Victorian allotment pond.  I need to investigate that with local records archive.
• Fast forward to mid 1990s, Dad starts noticing that the external walls front & rear appear to have moved off the damp course by 1/2 inch and so he puts some mortar on the gaps but does not contact his insurance (now direct line, since c 1996).  
• Fast Forward to c2014 and bathroom tiles start to push away from wall  (Dad assumes this was caused by him having the cavity walls insulated??) but this is mirrored on the external wall (at front of property) with stepped cracks of circa 1/4 inch
• C2019, further issues appearing:  cracks are appearing internally (stepped/diagonal), cracks through brickwork at rear of property under lounge window, diagonal cracks from above doorways, bedroom ceiling has multiple ripples & cracks and cracks to coving, lounge coving has moved to the extent that a 1/2inch step can be seen by door/central wall,  lounge door no longer fitting frame.  Front wall cracks are now wider and brick work is loose.

I instigated an enquiry with Dad's current Insurer (been with them circa 6 years) XYZ re poss subsidence claim and sent photos.  XYZ advised that they considered it was a possible subsidence claim and drains inspection was ordered. This ascertained that minor repairs were required to two front drains & the unblocking of the end of the 3m rear soakaway pipe but the amount of water loss did not lead to this being the suspected cause of the damage to the property. 

 I had to push for futher investigation and 360 Global Net monitoring were appointed by XYZ.  They drilled a 3 meter deep 6inx6in hole in front lawn to cite a measure point (sorry dont know correct term) & then (what looked like) brass screws were screwed into external brickwork about 1 meter apart 2 inches from the ground all around the property.  A group of 3 studs were also fitted to the external front crack area and ditto internal large lounge crack.  360 have now taken (2) readings over 4 months and say that although their measurements show minor movement they consider the property to be stable and what to discuss rectification

I have contacted a local structural engineer as I am majorly concerned that 360s stud monitoring is insufficent to get to the bottom of things:  he viewed the property and whilst he suspects that original poor building (insufficient foundations/dodgy brickwork) is the main cause he did say that to fully investigate the issue and determine all the causes would require the digging of several trial pits.  He says the evident damage all over the property certainly warrants more investgation than what 360 has done to date.

Question - how would you recommend I challenge 360/XYZ please?

Just to add (if you have all not lost the will to live), Dad & I had plans to improve the property (small front extension forWC/cloak, single storey rear extension 6x5m and a whole refurb of bungalow) and were prepared to spend c£80k.....................however until we know for sure what is going on (or not) with the ground, we are keeping the premium bonds.

I should add that if XYZ refuse investigation pits/other appropriate research (all info welcomed), then I would engage my own structural engineer at mu cost & if he did diagnose subsidence then I assume I could go back to XYZ for redress and I certainly wont be agreeing to rectification until I know.

Thank you, Ellie

tacpot12

I would put the local structural engineer's view to 360 and XYZ, after checking with the engineer that they are happy for you to refer to their advice. It would be best to get their advice in writing, and I think I would also ask them what would be a suitable level of investigation, and why the currently level of investigation isn't sufficient (in their professional opinion). 

I agree there is little point spending money if the foundations are suspect. Even with further work I'm not sure I would invest anything in this property. I've always liked the idea of knocking down bad buildings and rebuilding a good property in its place. 

[Deleted User]

tacpot12 said:

I would put the local structural engineer's view to 360 and XYZ, after checking with the engineer that they are happy for you to refer to their advice. It would be best to get their advice in writing, and I think I would also ask them what would be a suitable level of investigation, and why the currently level of investigation isn't sufficient (in their professional opinion). 

I agree there is little point spending money if the foundations are suspect. Even with further work I'm not sure I would invest anything in this property. I've always liked the idea of knocking down bad buildings and rebuilding a good property in its place. 

Thank you Tacpot12
Yes, my SE happy to be quoted and has given me appropriate wording re both current & recommended monitoring.

Dependent on what is discovered re land and/or original building we do have a full knock down and rebuild as an option (on raft to negate land issues - I really need to investigate this because Im just repeating what builders have said). 

The difficulty is that it is semi detached bungalow so rebuilding as a detached (without contributing to gable end rebuild and/or land) would not be viable.  (Although I suspect that next door has the same problems as us ie poor land and bad original building, especially across the back of bungalows).  Rebuilding as semi detached also presents issues I assume, if we need/want to change the foundations type ie raft. before building.

Lots to think and worry me about but first things first, back to 360......