Advice on renegotiation (or not) of house price

Snow_Angel

Hi all,

I'd really appreciate some advice (please be kind as I'm not experienced in house buying or house repairs!)

I'm in the process of buying a late 1800's house. I had a homebuyers level two survey and an independent damp & timber survey done. Due to the house's age I did expect a number of issues. I'm just wondering which of the following you'd consider including in a price renegotiation, if any, as they were things I wouldn't have forseen. I wouldn't be able to do any of the work myself as inexperienced.

For context, the house is in a highly desirable area and houses go immediately, always over asking price. There is also a real issue with supply in this area, with demand exceeding supply. That's not just recently, that's been the case for a number of years in this area. Including me, they had three offers at same price. So for these reasons I'm wondering whether to renegotiate at all.

The main issues are:
- High ground levels at rear of house breaching DPC causing very high internal damp readings. External ground level needs lowering and drainage installed.
- No party wall in loft space
- Replacement of front and back doors due to wet rot in timber doors (causing internal damp also)
- Reopening one chimney stack.
- Chimney needs repointing and cowls required
- Due to internal damp, replastering of kitchen, dining room and hallway needed when external damp issue is resolved.

(There were also many other issues but I haven't included them as either I anticipated them or I think they're minor).

TheJP

What valuation did the survey give you? That is the first thing to consider before opening negotiations.

Snow_Angel

TheJP said:

What valuation did the survey give you? That is the first thing to consider before opening negotiations.

Hi @TheJP The surveyor valued it at the offered price "provided that you are prepared to accept the cost and inconvenience of dealing with the various repair and improvement works reported".  So maybe I just have to decide to accept the costs.

lookstraightahead

I bought a mid-1800s house this year.
the issue isn't negotiation (when you view old houses you expect issues), it's about learning what all these issues are and whether you are happy to spend the time and money putting it right.

You need to understand what damp means, especially with old houses, and pick each item apart.

if you are going into this expecting not to spend money, it's the wrong house for you.

if you want to lovingly restore an old house, then it maybe is.

We've been pleasantly surprised so far, but we understand that we might be spending tens of thousands over the coming years.

my first questions would be;

why a level 2 instead of a level 3?
why has a 1800s house got a damp proof course?

but it's only because I'm learning! 

canaldumidi

You'll need to spend a little money on the house, but not significant, so budget for that. Given the market you describe I would not renegotiate.

Snow_Angel said:

The main issues are:
- High ground levels at rear of house breaching DPC causing very high internal damp readings. External ground level needs lowering and drainage installed.

What is outside causing the high fround level? A flowerbed? A patio? Drive? Is it soil, conctete....? In most cases fairly easy to dig a trench around the wall (12"?) ad fill with gravel. DIY over a weekend. Of course if it's a narrow driveway and losing 12" makes it too narrow that might be an issue.

- No party wall in loft space May houses that age had/have no party wall. Nowadays the rules for new builds is there should be a rire resistant dividing wall, but there are 1000s of properties without. Install one or not at your discretion.
- Replacement of front and back doors due to wet rot in timber doors (causing internal damp also). Budget for new doors. Cost depends largey on wood you choose. Quality hardwood will cost more but last (nearly) forever. Google for costs.
- Reopening one chimney stack. Surely you could just insert an airbrick in the stack if the problem is lack of circulation/damp? Chap on a ladder. (scaffolding will cost more if eeded).
- Chimney needs repointing and cowls required Ah! well combine that work with the airbrick(s). Probably not urgent so do it all when funds allow.
- Due to internal damp, replastering of kitchen, dining room and hallway needed when external damp issue is resolved.

Again not urgent and yes, all the damp prevention jobs need doing first, as well as some time to let things dry out, so replastering and redecoration will have to wait. Can you live with it as is?

If you want an immaculate house tomove into, this is not for you. If you're happy to do these jobs, spread the cost over a couple of years, it's actually not that significant.

TheJP

Snow_Angel said:

TheJP said:

What valuation did the survey give you? That is the first thing to consider before opening negotiations.

Hi @TheJP The surveyor valued it at the offered price "provided that you are prepared to accept the cost and inconvenience of dealing with the various repair and improvement works reported".  So maybe I just have to decide to accept the costs.

Sounds like the house was priced with the issues in mind. Its up to you whether to proceed or not knowing you'll have things to factor into your budget. Does that put you off the house? You can still try and negotiate but if the sellers know there are things that need updating and have priced with that in mind then you may need to walk away.

canaldumidi

lookstraightahead said:

....
why has a 1800s house got a damp proof course?

My house is 1851 (says so in roman numerals over the door). It has a perfetly good slate dpc.

Snow_Angel

canaldumidi said:

You'll need to spend a little money on the house, but not significant, so budget for that. Given the market you describe I would not renegotiate.

Snow_Angel said:

The main issues are:
- High ground levels at rear of house breaching DPC causing very high internal damp readings. External ground level needs lowering and drainage installed.

What is outside causing the high fround level? A flowerbed? A patio? Drive? Is it soil, conctete....? In most cases fairly easy to dig a trench around the wall (12"?) ad fill with gravel. DIY over a weekend. Of course if it's a narrow driveway and losing 12" makes it too narrow that might be an issue.

- Reopening one chimney stack. Surely you could just insert an airbrick in the stack if the problem is lack of circulation/damp? Chap on a ladder. (scaffolding will cost more if eeded).

- It's a patio. Plenty of space for a 12" trench. But I certainly wouldn't be able to do this myself. Sounds like it wouldn't be too expensive a job.
- Sorry maybe didn't make clear. It's a ground floor chimney stack that needs the fireplace reopening. Also easy for someone with the DIY skills (not me and don't want to botch it!).

Thanks also for your other comments. You've put my mind at ease. I think my common sense also agrees with you about not renegotiating given the circumstances. 

Snow_Angel

lookstraightahead said:

I bought a mid-1800s house this year.
the issue isn't negotiation (when you view old houses you expect issues), it's about learning what all these issues are and whether you are happy to spend the time and money putting it right.

You need to understand what damp means, especially with old houses, and pick each item apart.

if you are going into this expecting not to spend money, it's the wrong house for you.

if you want to lovingly restore an old house, then it maybe is.

We've been pleasantly surprised so far, but we understand that we might be spending tens of thousands over the coming years.

my first questions would be;

why a level 2 instead of a level 3?
why has a 1800s house got a damp proof course?

but it's only because I'm learning! 

Hi @lookstraightahead and thanks for your reply.

I'm actually looking forward to renovating it and making it exactly my style. It's just the issues I listed were things I wasn't aware were problems when I moved in.

I'm happy the independent damp & timber surveyor identified the main damp causes.

I didn't get a level 3 as looking at RICS suggestions for survey levels it didn't seem necessary. 

Don't know the answer about your DPC question I'm afraid.

Snow_Angel

TheJP said:

Snow_Angel said:

TheJP said:

What valuation did the survey give you? That is the first thing to consider before opening negotiations.

Hi @TheJP The surveyor valued it at the offered price "provided that you are prepared to accept the cost and inconvenience of dealing with the various repair and improvement works reported".  So maybe I just have to decide to accept the costs.

Sounds like the house was priced with the issues in mind. Its up to you whether to proceed or not knowing you'll have things to factor into your budget. Does that put you off the house? You can still try and negotiate but if the sellers know there are things that need updating and have priced with that in mind then you may need to walk away.

Hi @TheJP No, definitely doesn't put me off. It's in a really popular area and one I love. I've rented in this area for 12 years and for the past 7 in a house exactly the same age & size on the next street (thankfully can afford to buy here now).

lookstraightahead

I love my old house, creaks, wobbly walls, and all.
be careful that you get the right damp advice etc, ie, don't use new treatments for old houses.