£12 over limit fee for going 73p over for 2 days

eskbanker

moneymoner said:
Some banks do not even take a card payment from your account balance until several days later.

Where such delays occur, it'll almost always be the responsibility of the retailer in submitting transactions for settlement, rather than banks being dilatory in processing them.

moneymoner said:
I applied for a limit on my credit card and that limit is being increased by the provider when a purchase is made with insufficient funds. If I were paying with cash then the purchase would certainly not proceed as I would easily see I do not have enough funds in my wallet. The credit card provider is being irresponsible here by allowing the transaction to complete and then applying a fee for an unarranged loan.

If you want the sort of real-time budgetary control that comes with using cash, then use cash!  It's not irresponsible for card providers to allow some latitude where transactions exceed limits, unless this is done excessively, although it is undoubtedly usually in their financial interests to do so, as you say, rather than any genuine sense of altruism in terms of being concerned for customer convenience....

moneymoner

eskbanker said:

If you want the sort of real-time budgetary control that comes with using cash, then use cash!  It's not irresponsible for card providers to allow some latitude where transactions exceed limits, unless this is done excessively, although it is undoubtedly usually in their financial interests to do so, as you say, rather than any genuine sense of altruism in terms of being concerned for customer convenience....

The point I am getting at is that the transaction is allowed to proceed without any actual check on the funds available. As it is now becoming mandatory to pay for all transactions by electronic means, cash is now longer the option for many services.

Banks and cc's are exploiting these situations where your balance is not known to the penny and debits and transactions are not always on the exact day they due or taken. How difficult and problematic is it now for banks and cc's to process a simple transaction than it used to be with simple cash over the counter. Charges for processing electronic transactions, charges for using credit cards, excessive fees for having to press an few extra keys or mouse clicks...etc..etc I thought paying electronically was less work and more streamlined than cash and cheques. Seems not with all these fee's and charges.

moneymoner

eskbanker said:

If you want the sort of real-time budgetary control that comes with using cash, then use cash!  It's not irresponsible for card providers to allow some latitude where transactions exceed limits, unless this is done excessively, although it is undoubtedly usually in their financial interests to do so, as you say, rather than any genuine sense of altruism in terms of being concerned for customer convenience....

If your credit card limit and balance is £1000 and a transaction of £250 is allowed, then to me, that makes my credit limit £1250. Why have a credit limit ? I thought the credit limit was there to prevent over spending and use of the credit card. You were mis-sold the credit card in that case as where you expected a limit to be in place.

So with banks and cc's not really having any concern about protecting you from spiralling debt but rather pushing you into it for their own financial interests and gains.

Is it my fault or ignorance that credit or debit card transactions are not yet possible to be processed instantly in 2021, where this has always been possible with cash payments ?

redux

You have a perfect right and ability to check the balance of the account if you think it might be getting close, and to send an extra interim payment to the card account ahead of the intended usual monthly payment.

moneymoner said:

Banks and cc's are exploiting these situations where your balance is not known to the penny and debits and transactions are not always on the exact day they due or taken. How difficult and problematic is it now for banks and cc's to process a simple transaction than it used to be with simple cash over the counter. Charges for processing electronic transactions, charges for using credit cards, excessive fees for having to press an few extra keys or mouse clicks...etc..etc I thought paying electronically was less work and more streamlined than cash and cheques. Seems not with all these fee's and charges.

I don't recognise this description of all these surcharges.

If you're in a pub that has a £5 minimum limit for contactless, and one beer is £4, that's the policy of the pub, not the bank. Either pay the next one in advance with the first, persuade them to reduce the limit (which some have done), or pay with cash.

HeinzVarieties

moneymoner said:

eskbanker said:

If you want the sort of real-time budgetary control that comes with using cash, then use cash!  It's not irresponsible for card providers to allow some latitude where transactions exceed limits, unless this is done excessively, although it is undoubtedly usually in their financial interests to do so, as you say, rather than any genuine sense of altruism in terms of being concerned for customer convenience....

The point I am getting at is that the transaction is allowed to proceed without any actual check on the funds available. As it is now becoming mandatory to pay for all transactions by electronic means, cash is now longer the option for many services.

Banks and cc's are exploiting these situations where your balance is not known to the penny and debits and transactions are not always on the exact day they due or taken. How difficult and problematic is it now for banks and cc's to process a simple transaction than it used to be with simple cash over the counter. Charges for processing electronic transactions, charges for using credit cards, excessive fees for having to press an few extra keys or mouse clicks...etc..etc I thought paying electronically was less work and more streamlined than cash and cheques. Seems not with all these fee's and charges.

The same happens when you get in a taxi.  Is the taxi driver supposed to shake you down to make sure you can afford the ride or are you supposed to ensure you have the cash available to pay for the things you've requested?

Hiding behind cash is no different than hiding behind the bank.  You are expected to know how much money you have because you're an adult and that's expected of you.

Sorry for becoming one but the only way out is death.

eskbanker

moneymoner said:

The point I am getting at is that the transaction is allowed to proceed without any actual check on the funds available. 

No, the available funds check is made, but there will typically be a tolerance, so it's not as simple as 'accept if within the stated limit or decline if beyond it'.

moneymoner said:
Banks and cc's are exploiting these situations where your balance is not known to the penny and debits and transactions are not always on the exact day they due or taken. How difficult and problematic is it now for banks and cc's to process a simple transaction than it used to be with simple cash over the counter. Charges for processing electronic transactions, charges for using credit cards, excessive fees for having to press an few extra keys or mouse clicks...etc..etc I thought paying electronically was less work and more streamlined than cash and cheques. Seems not with all these fee's and charges.

More streamlined, yes, but at a cost - banks have made massive investments in technology in order to facilitate electronic transactions, so will naturally seek to recoup such costs, and of course make a profit, as that's what they're in business to do.  However, as a customer, if you always pay your monthly bill in full and avoid exceeding your limit of course, you should be able to use a credit card at no cost whatsoever, so can benefit from all that convenience without having to pay for it at all!

moneymoner said:
If your credit card limit and balance is £1000 and a transaction of £250 is allowed, then to me, that makes my credit limit £1250. Why have a credit limit ? I thought the credit limit was there to prevent over spending and use of the credit card. You were mis-sold the credit card in that case as where you expected a limit to be in place.

No, if that's how you believed credit limits to work then you were wrong.  Credit limits are set to reflect the amount of lending deemed appropriate but it's not a hard and fast barrier, which is why all card tariffs will state an over-limit fee - you mentioned earlier about going over your limit by a few pence but now you're talking about exceeding it by 25%, which would be less likely, are you just exaggerating now for effect?

moneymoner said:

So with banks and cc's not really having any concern about protecting you from spiralling debt but rather pushing you into it for their own financial interests and gains.

As above, their motives won't be altruism, but bear in mind that they're lending you money - if you over-borrow then that starts to become more of a risk for them too, so it's not a one-way bet, which is why it's unlikely that transactions would continue to be approved if significantly beyond the agreed credit limit....

moneymoner said:

Is it my fault or ignorance that credit or debit card transactions are not yet possible to be processed instantly in 2021, where this has always been possible with cash payments ?

Many, perhaps most, are now processed practically instantaneously, in terms of reducing available credit, but as above, most delays are down to retailers rather than banks.  What makes you feel that cash is a meaningful comparison?

moneymoner

HeinzVarieties said:

The same happens when you get in a taxi.  Is the taxi driver supposed to shake you down to make sure you can afford the ride or are you supposed to ensure you have the cash available to pay for the things you've requested?

Hiding behind cash is no different than hiding behind the bank.  You are expected to know how much money you have because you're an adult and that's expected of you.

Sorry for becoming one but the only way out is death.

Yeah, just like buying something in the supermarket, does not stop the taxi driver from taking you further into the journey either or over charging you. Your anologies has nothing to do with being told by a credit card issuer that your credit limit is so much but then turns out to be whatever amount they choose it to be. Mis-sold on the basis that you were told you had a LIMIT (a point or level beyond which something does not or may not extend or pass) on what you could spend using the card. Are you so dumb that you do not understand what a limit is and you somehow try to see this has variable ?

moneymoner

eskbanker said:

No, the available funds check is made, but there will typically be a tolerance, so it's not as simple as 'accept if within the stated limit or decline if beyond it'.

So the check of available funds is or can be made but this method is not used ?

With cash it was physical impossible to pull more money out of your wallet that you had, unless you were a magician who carried all their money in a top hat.

The point I make is that, although I don't really disagree with electronic payment methods entirely, I do disagree with the exploits the cc's use in order to charge extortionate fee's as in subject of this conversation.

Like I said previously, I also have many micro-payments and debits registered with my card but dates are never on the exact day or taken when expected. Checking my account blanace every day is a much longer process than many may think, esp if you do not use mobile banking or are have a disability.

Many here seem to think that banks and cc's are right in the fee's and charges that they endorse but seems this was not right before the whole cahrging and fee system was reviewed.

moneymoner

redux said:

I don't recognise this description of all these surcharges.

If you're in a pub that has a £5 minimum limit for contactless, and one beer is £4, that's the policy of the pub, not the bank. Either pay the next one in advance with the first, persuade them to reduce the limit (which some have done), or pay with cash.

Well your reply just emphasises the point the there is a charge for using electronic payment cards. Otherwise why would there be a minimum payment to use a card. A pub would never say, sorry you can only buy 2 beers here with cash and they would certainly not charge their punters £3 for a beer paid with cash and £4 for a beer paid with a card.

moneymoner

Is it just as impractical to display a notice before making a payment that a transaction would incur a £12 fee, as many cash dispensers do, as it is to simly check a balance and decline a transaction ?