Crypto.com earn 10% interest on tgbp

Aegis

darren232002 said:

Aegis said:

Then explain how these are structured. If the loan assets are only lent out with the caveat that they will automatically be repaid at a given point, then they aren't as valuable as an unencumbered asset, if the loan assets are free of that sort of burden, allowing the holder to freely make decisions on what to do with them, then defaults can happen. There's just no feasible way to structure loans in such a way that they can't be defaulted on.

A+ financial knowledge there Mr. Chartered Financial Planner. 

Thanks. Seems obvious to me, but what do I know, I just work in finance. Clearly I need to be schooled by someone on the internet with the credentials "some guy".

Aegis said:

No, instead you're here making snide remarks. Clearly that really helps your case.

How should you treat someone who repeatedly asks questions that could be answered with a simple search of the forum?  There's one main Bitcoin thread and/or its not like I have 5.5k posts. Independent research isn't a dirty thing to participate in.

If it's so simple, link to it. Otherewise you can choose to spend a huge amount of time mocking those of us who don't believe the way you do. Either way, the response will demonstrate your character. Based on previous experience, I very much doubt that any such information actually exists unless you start with the supposition that the crypto asset in question has value.
Constantly sniping at me because I dare to question your Holy Grail just makes you look like you know that what you're doing is irrational and you want to bury it in insults.

Malthusian said:

Borrowing money doesn't avoid CGT. Borrowing costs are sometimes relievable against income tax in certain circumstances, but not against gains. Evading tax because your head is too full of crypto bro "staking" jargon to learn the rules is still evading tax.

Owning BTC and never selling it means you are never liable for CGT. Meanwhile, you can borrow against those assets at low rates to unlock your capital. Nothing wrong with that, happens all the time. Tax avoidance is perfectly legal.

You can literally substitute any asset into that statement and the same is true. This isn't some new scheme that crypto investors have found - lending against assets is a long-standing offering of many financial institutions. This really doesn't answer the question of why someone would take out a loan at 12%, which was the example actually given.

Malthusian said:

Early entrants made 100%pa on the "strongest, safest protocols" but returns have already slowed to a mere 10%pa? Well this definitely sounds like an exciting trend and a good time to put my money on the table.

Showing those excellent critical thinking skills again I see...I referred to "140% APY on an asset that has done a 10x" vs "10%-30% on stablecoins."

With a modicum of analysis, we should be able to conclude that stablecoins aren't doing a 10x and it makes perfect sense that you would expect a lower rate on a dollar pegged asset compared to a market priced one. One has not become the other. These comments were made about competing ends of the market.

I've only ever suggested the stablecoin rate here for others because most people here would have no idea how to pick a suitable token to farm or stake in order to ensure the rate isn't negated by a fall in value.

The idea of being able to generate returns of up to 30% on an asset pegged to a currency is just ludicrous. If you buy something worth 1 dollar and know that it will be worth 1 dollar whenever you sell it, your expected rate of return in non-inflation adjusted terms must be close to zero in dollar terms. Any returns must therefore come from, for example, forex trading, so if GBP strengthens against the dollar and your assets are pegged to GBP, then you benefit if you are looking at dollar returns. Obviously that's a very dangerous game and not one that I want to get involved in.

User232002

Aegis said:

Thanks. Seems obvious to me, but what do I know, I just work in finance. Clearly I need to be schooled by someone on the internet with the credentials "some guy".

Again with the appeal to authority and credentials when you've literally just said that something is impossible when it patently isnt. The question how isn't a bad one, but when I had that question a year ago, I spent 10 minutes online and found the answer pretty quickly.

Aegis said:

If it's so simple, link to it. Otherewise you can choose to spend a huge amount of time mocking those of us who don't believe the way you do. Either way, the response will demonstrate your character. Based on previous experience, I very much doubt that any such information actually exists unless you start with the supposition that the crypto asset in question has value. Constantly sniping at me because I dare to question your Holy Grail just makes you look like you know that what you're doing is irrational and you want to bury it in insults.

Its hilarious that you're talking about my character here. I'm telling you that the answers are out there if you just lifted your finger and did some searching and you're shouting at me "No, you tell me, or I'll assume it doesn't exist." When did seeking out knowledge actually become a bad thing to suggest someone else engage in? When did people become entitled to be spoon fed information?

If you don't want to do your due diligence that's cool. If you want to assume it doesn't exist, crack on. More money for the rest of us tbh. But lets not pretend that a refusal to do the basics of research is the moral high ground or gives you the right to talk about things you know nothing about.

Aegis said:

You can literally substitute any asset into that statement and the same is true. This isn't some new scheme that crypto investors have found - lending against assets is a long-standing offering of many financial institutions. This really doesn't answer the question of why someone would take out a loan at 12%, which was the example actually given.

This statement is you making up things that you think I've said. I'm not arguing against points I havent made.

(1) I never proclaimed this was unique to crypto. Thanks for confirming its a valid strategy though.

As for the 12%, as I said earlier,

(2) that statement was started by a non Bitcoiner who has no idea what they are talking about (Gary1984) so please don't attempt to suggest that I said that. I'm not going to defend an argument that's more on the end of being incorrect than correct. I've told you that I've personally taken loans out against my assets at 1% (and 5% too). That's my assertion. Are we agreed that there would be legitimate reasons to do that?

Aegis said:

The idea of being able to generate returns of up to 30% on an asset pegged to a currency is just ludicrous. If you buy something worth 1 dollar and know that it will be worth 1 dollar whenever you sell it, your expected rate of return in non-inflation adjusted terms must be close to zero in dollar terms. Any returns must therefore come from, for example, forex trading, so if GBP strengthens against the dollar and your assets are pegged to GBP, then you benefit if you are looking at dollar returns. Obviously that's a very dangerous game and not one that I want to get involved in.  

Uniswap. Sushiswap. Liquidity provision. Arbitrage trading. Not going over this again. 

I have been doing it for a year now, so please keep telling me how ludicrous this is. Frankly, 30% APY in this market is a snoozefest, so my capital is mainly deployed elsewhere.

Aegis

darren232002 said:

Aegis said:

Thanks. Seems obvious to me, but what do I know, I just work in finance. Clearly I need to be schooled by someone on the internet with the credentials "some guy".

Again with the appeal to authority and credentials when you've literally just said that something is impossible when it patently isnt. The question how isn't a bad one, but when I had that question a year ago, I spent 10 minutes online and found the answer pretty quickly.

Yep, it's an appeal to authority.  This is only a fallacy when someone wants to use that authority to back up an unrelated argument.  It's fairly safe to say that I would be considered an expert at investments and lending (indeed, I am contemplating carrying out some training to be an Expert Witness, most of which is court process and billing rather than specific knowledge of my subjects).  And yes, I have credentials which demonstrate some of my knowledge and commitment to this profession.  Belittling those won't make them less meaningful.

A doctor providing information on an infection is appealing to their authority and credentials in much the same way.

Again though, you claim it's really easy to find answers.  So post them.  You've spent countless hours explaining to others that they should do what you could instead spend a maximum of 10 minutes on, but instead you do everything possible to avoid answering questions.  Everything else you say and do in response to the questions is completely irrelevant.

Aegis said:

If it's so simple, link to it. Otherewise you can choose to spend a huge amount of time mocking those of us who don't believe the way you do. Either way, the response will demonstrate your character. Based on previous experience, I very much doubt that any such information actually exists unless you start with the supposition that the crypto asset in question has value. Constantly sniping at me because I dare to question your Holy Grail just makes you look like you know that what you're doing is irrational and you want to bury it in insults.

Its hilarious that you're talking about my character here. I'm telling you that the answers are out there if you just lifted your finger and did some searching and you're shouting at me "No, you tell me, or I'll assume it doesn't exist." When did seeking out knowledge actually become a bad thing to suggest someone else engage in? When did people become entitled to be spoon fed information?

If you don't want to do your due diligence that's cool. If you want to assume it doesn't exist, crack on. More money for the rest of us tbh. But lets not pretend that a refusal to do the basics of research is the moral high ground or gives you the right to talk about things you know nothing about.

Yes, you character comes across in how you choose to interact with others.  So far you have insulted me and generally been condescending.  These don't promote good character.  If you would prefer me to have a different view of you, change your behaviour.

And for the record, I have every right to talk here, same as everyone else.  There isn't a knowledge test for being allowed to discuss certain topics, and if there was I still believe I could pass a test designed to allow people to talk about cryptos as an investment.

In summary, I have done my research, I don't believe your claims, ball's in your court if you want to actually provide simple information.

Aegis said:

The idea of being able to generate returns of up to 30% on an asset pegged to a currency is just ludicrous. If you buy something worth 1 dollar and know that it will be worth 1 dollar whenever you sell it, your expected rate of return in non-inflation adjusted terms must be close to zero in dollar terms. Any returns must therefore come from, for example, forex trading, so if GBP strengthens against the dollar and your assets are pegged to GBP, then you benefit if you are looking at dollar returns. Obviously that's a very dangerous game and not one that I want to get involved in.  

Uniswap. Sushiswap. Liquidity provision. Arbitrage trading. Not going over this again. 

I have been doing it for a year now, so please keep telling me how ludicrous this is. Frankly, 30% APY in this market is a snoozefest, so my capital is mainly deployed elsewhere.

Yeah, I don't believe you.  You haven't provided any information to make me think this is plausible despite the fact that it clearly means a lot to you and you are happy to spend hours arguing about it. 

lozzy1965

Just plugging "Uniswap. Sushiswap. Liquidity provision. Arbitrage trading" into a google search and I am reminded of what happens when one searches "forex trading".  Lot's of articles/you tube videos telling you how rich you can get.  Now I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who are getting rich, but are there plenty (more) getting poor too?
Honestly, all this stuff just hurts my poor brain when I try to understand it!  I'm too old for all this maybe
I am genuinely interested in both sides of the argument, I just can't get my head round it all!!!

We are in danger of moving into a crypto chat here though - when there is a bitcoin thread for bitcoin, and a crypto thread for crypto, and this thread is specifically about 10% interest on crypto.

Aegis

lozzy1965 said:

Just plugging "Uniswap. Sushiswap. Liquidity provision. Arbitrage trading" into a google search and I am reminded of what happens when one searches "forex trading".  Lot's of articles/you tube videos telling you how rich you can get.  Now I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who are getting rich, but are there plenty (more) getting poor too?
Honestly, all this stuff just hurts my poor brain when I try to understand it!  I'm too old for all this maybe
I am genuinely interested in both sides of the argument, I just can't get my head round it all!!!

We are in danger of moving into a crypto chat here though - when there is a bitcoin thread for bitcoin, and a crypto thread for crypto, and this thread is specifically about 10% interest on crypto.

Careful, you're on the verge of being mocked for doing no research because you didn't instantly believe everything you just found!

User232002

Aegis said:

Yes, you character comes across in how you choose to interact with others.  So far you have insulted me and generally been condescending.  These don't promote good character.  If you would prefer me to have a different view of you, change your behaviour.

Where are those insults? Aside from one post that got deleted, I have not insulted you. I've attacked your arguments because I believe in the scientific method and you haven't really been able to back any of your arguments up. You conveniently forget to reply when you have no idea what to say. 

Yes, I'm being condescending. I have little tolerance for people suffering from the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Aegis said:

And for the record, I have every right to talk here, same as everyone else.  There isn't a knowledge test for being allowed to discuss certain topics, and if there was I still believe I could pass a test designed to allow people to talk about cryptos as an investment.

Whilst I never said you have no right to talk here, there is, in my opinion, an honest expectation that posters should engage in good faith debate. That means its not acceptable to make assertions about things you have no knowledge of.

You (1) don't know the difference between the main basic cryptographic tokens, BTC, ETH and UNI/AAVE etc (2) don't understand how crypto lending platforms work and (3) think DOGE and BTC are indistinguishable. We haven't even begun to discuss smart contract platforms, NFTs, DeFi regulation risks and L2 solutions. You are not passing that test and you are someone I would suggest needs to understand the basics of BTC before anything else.

Aegis said:

In summary, I have done my research, I don't believe your claims, ball's in your court if you want to actually provide simple information.

In argument, we don't put forward a series of statements, leave for some time, come back and start from scratch all over again having the same discussions. Its inefficient at best and a boring waste of time at worst. I should not be expected to back up every assertion I've made in every new thread all over again simply because you can't press a search button. That's a completely ludicrous position to hold.

Aegis said:

Yeah, I don't believe you.  You haven't provided any information to make me think this is plausible despite the fact that it clearly means a lot to you and you are happy to spend hours arguing about it. 

Newsflash: Its not about you. The point is to leave enough breadcrumbs so that when an actual curious mind comes across these debates, they don't find a one sided debate or they don't simply follow the dogma of traditional finance people like yourself.

Anyway. Cool. Good luck. Lets see how that works out for you over the next 5 years.

Aegis

darren232002 said:

Aegis said:

Yes, you character comes across in how you choose to interact with others.  So far you have insulted me and generally been condescending.  These don't promote good character.  If you would prefer me to have a different view of you, change your behaviour.

Where are those insults? Aside from one post that got deleted, I have not insulted you. I've attacked your arguments because I believe in the scientific method and you haven't really been able to back any of your arguments up. You conveniently forget to reply when you have no idea what to say. 

Yes, I'm being condescending. I have little tolerance for people suffering from the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Aegis said:

And for the record, I have every right to talk here, same as everyone else.  There isn't a knowledge test for being allowed to discuss certain topics, and if there was I still believe I could pass a test designed to allow people to talk about cryptos as an investment.

Whilst I never said you have no right to talk here, there is, in my opinion, an honest expectation that posters should engage in good faith debate. That means its not acceptable to make assertions about things you have no knowledge of.

You (1) don't know the difference between the main basic cryptographic tokens, BTC, ETH and UNI/AAVE etc (2) don't understand how crypto lending platforms work and (3) think DOGE and BTC are indistinguishable. We haven't even begun to discuss smart contract platforms, NFTs, DeFi regulation risks and L2 solutions. You are not passing that test and you are someone I would suggest needs to understand the basics of BTC before anything else.

Aegis said:

In summary, I have done my research, I don't believe your claims, ball's in your court if you want to actually provide simple information.

In argument, we don't put forward a series of statements, leave for some time, come back and start from scratch all over again having the same discussions. Its inefficient at best and a boring waste of time at worst. I should not be expected to back up every assertion I've made in every new thread all over again simply because you can't press a search button. That's a completely ludicrous position to hold.

Aegis said:

Yeah, I don't believe you.  You haven't provided any information to make me think this is plausible despite the fact that it clearly means a lot to you and you are happy to spend hours arguing about it. 

Newsflash: Its not about you. The point is to leave enough breadcrumbs so that when an actual curious mind comes across these debates, they don't find a one sided debate or they don't simply follow the dogma of traditional finance people like yourself.

Anyway. Cool. Good luck. Lets see how that works out for you over the next 5 years.

Stil no information to post?  Cool, exactly as predicted.

Malthusian

lozzy1965 said:

Just plugging "Uniswap. Sushiswap. Liquidity provision. Arbitrage trading" into a google search and I am reminded of what happens when one searches "forex trading".  Lot's of articles/you tube videos telling you how rich you can get.  Now I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who are getting rich, but are there plenty (more) getting poor too?

Congratulations, as the bros demand you have done your research, and spotted the secret of how to get rich from magic Internet money. I.e. punters' money in == punters' money out.

We are in danger of moving into a crypto chat here though - when there is a bitcoin thread for bitcoin, and a crypto thread for crypto, and this thread is specifically about 10% interest on crypto.

Meh. 10% interest on crypto tokens in more crypto tokens is neither here nor there, it's paid purely for cargo cult reasons. "Paying fixed interest is something people do with currency, therefore if we pay interest on tokens (even though it's irrelevant as it's dwarfed by the fluctuating price of the token) everyone will start using crypto as currency, therefore number go up and we'll be rich." This thread is as good as all the others.

tebbins

@darren232002

How do I earn more than 10% on an untied coin? I've not heard of this yet.

adam06_2

tebbins said:

@darren232002

How do I earn more than 10% on an untied coin? I've not heard of this yet.

Looking on crypto.com for example. You can earn 14.5% on DOT... But you need to be staking 40k usd worth of CRO (crypto.com's native coin) and you are locked in for 3 months.. without the CRO staking it's 10%.