County Court Claim- Questions RE: defence

SocialEyes

Hi

I've read through Newbies and suggested template and think Im quite clear on what needs to happen. 

I received a county court claim form for a PCN that is 5 years old. I have made a SAR to UKPC and requested DCB legal put the case on hold for 30 days. I am still yet to complete the AOS on MCOL but will do this very soon. 

Some questions in preparation for my defence as per #2 and #3-
1. I am not the registered keeper of the car in question. Can a defence be on this basis?
2. The claim is for a PCN from 5 years ago and I dont even recall what I did or did not see. Vaguely recollect it appeared to be a recreational ground car park and I cant recall seeing signage or it being clear that parking charges applied. But beyond that I dont know what else I can put in these sections because it was a log time ago and I remember very little. Does this matter? 
3. Bar #2 and #3 of the defence and the details of my particular claim, Can I just copy and paste the defence as is? 

Thank you for all this advice. Its very supportive.

Fruitcake

1. If you have been identified as the driver of the vehicle, then whether or not you are the keeper is irrelevant. If you were the keeper but not the driver then it could make a huge difference if the NTK was not PoFA complaint, but not the other way round. In para 2 of the defence you should say whether you were the keeper or driver or both, but liability is denied.

2. Signage is already covered in the defence template so you need to state that the defendant did not see any signage, or that that there was no signage visible, whichever is true.

3. Yes, use the rest of the template as it is, but please only show us the parts you have changed.

Where did the alleged event occur? It may have cropped up here before. Google Streetview may have historical images that might be of some use.

What was the reason for the PCN? 
Was it appealed?
What happened when you complained to the landowner?

KeithP

SocialEyes said:

I received a county court claim form issue date 11/10/21 for a PCN that is 5 years old. I have made a SAR to UKPC and requested DCB legal put the case on hold for 30 days. I am still yet to complete the AOS on MCOL but will do this very soon. 

Hello and welcome.

With a Claim Issue Date of 11th October, you have until Monday 1st November to file an Acknowledgment of Service but there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

To file an AoS, follow the guidance in the Dropbox file linked from the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Having filed an AoS in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 15th November 2021 to file your Defence.

That's four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look again at the second post on the NEWBIES thread - immediately following where you found the Acknowledgment of Service instructions.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an Acknowledgment of Service has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.

SocialEyes

Fruitcake said:

1. If you have been identified as the driver of the vehicle, then whether or not you are the keeper is irrelevant. If you were the keeper but not the driver then it could make a huge difference if the NTK was not PoFA complaint, but not the other way round. In para 2 of the defence you should say whether you were the keeper or driver or both, but liability is denied.

2. Signage is already covered in the defence template so you need to state that the defendant did not see any signage, or that that there was no signage visible, whichever is true.

3. Yes, use the rest of the template as it is, but please only show us the parts you have changed.

Where did the alleged event occur? It may have cropped up here before. Google Streetview may have historical images that might be of some use.

What was the reason for the PCN? 
Was it appealed?
What happened when you complained to the landowner?

Jack Straws Castle North, Hampstead Heath.
Reason for PCN- 'The vehicle was parked in breach of the terms on c's sign's (the contract). the driver agreed to pay within28 days (I didnt). The contract entitles C to damages.'
Didnt appeal the PCN.
I havent complained to the landowner. 

KeithP

SocialEyes said:

 the driver agreed to pay within28 days (I didnt).

The allegation is that by parking the driver agreed to the terms of the contract.

Those contract terms are the terms on the signs.

Almost certainly there is a term on the signs stating something like "if the driver doesn't park in accordance with the rules then he agrees to pay £nn within 28 days...".

SocialEyes

KeithP said:

SocialEyes said:

 the driver agreed to pay within28 days (I didnt).

The allegation is that by parking the driver agreed to the terms of the contract.

Those contract terms are the terms on the signs.

Almost certainly there is a term on the signs stating something like "if the driver doesn't park in accordance with the rules then he agrees to pay £nn within 28 days...".

Yeah I suspected that. 

Another question is if it progresses to witness statement stage then the advice in here seems to point to getting photos of the area. I live quite a distance from the site of the PCN. Is this really necessary?

Fruitcake

Have a look at Google Streetview to see if there are any historic images that might help. Cross your fingers that there may be posters that are near and can help or may have their own historic images.

KeithP

SocialEyes said:

KeithP said:

SocialEyes said:

 the driver agreed to pay within28 days (I didnt).

The allegation is that by parking the driver agreed to the terms of the contract.

Those contract terms are the terms on the signs.

Almost certainly there is a term on the signs stating something like "if the driver doesn't park in accordance with the rules then he agrees to pay £nn within 28 days...".

Another question is if it progresses to witness statement stage then the advice in here seems to point to getting photos of the area. I live quite a distance from the site of the PCN. Is this really necessary?

No of course evidence isn't necessary.
Evidence is only needed if you want to prove something different to what the Claimant is claiming. Do you want to do that?

Presumably the driver was visiting someone.

Can that 'someone' not help with photos?

What about social media? A local facebook group?

Fruitcake

Is this the place? Image capture April this year.




Car park at the end belonging to the building with forbidding sign at the entrance. Zooming in you can just make out that the signs on wall are for UKPC. To the right is a Corporation of London car park. Image capture June 2015.

Coupon-mad

If you have a claim form you are not meant to contact the solicitor asking for the case to be put on hold.  That's in the advice about LBC stage.

SocialEyes

 Fruitcake said:

Is this the place? Image capture April this year.




Car park at the end belonging to the building with forbidding sign at the entrance. Zooming in you can just make out that the signs on wall are for UKPC. To the right is a Corporation of London car park. Image capture June 2015.

yes thats the one. 

Coupon-mad said:

If you have a claim form you are not meant to contact the solicitor asking for the case to be put on hold.  That's in the advice about LBC stage.

Ok so my mistake contacting the solicitor. Was doing the SAR also a waste of time? Thought its important to qualify what evidence they have? Nevertheless the DPO is asking me to confirm my identity by providing i) vehicle log to prove ownership (I no longer own the car) and ii) PCN ref. number, which I think are stated in the particulars of claim on the claim form.