Pensions envy. Are we heading for financially comfortable but socially uncomfortable retirements?

DoublePolaroid

grocerjack said:

Workerdrone said:

For me and probably quite a few on here pension saving is almost a hobby. I set a target date and amount and I get a kick out of finding ways to put extra away or when I see my pot grow.

But I realise this is not for everyone. When reading the news/other forums/Facebook editorials I tend to jump on articles which mention pensions. Having read the article, I then scroll down to the comments.

Theres a shocking amount of negativity around pensions in general, ranging from "I can't afford to save anything", "Who on earth has a million pound pension:", "It's the governments fault we have the lowest state pension in Europe" to "Pensions are a con".

Interspersed in this is the very occasional voice of reason pointing out the tax breaks and even the odd brave soul staring the uncomfortable truth "If you don't save, you have no-one to blame but yourself". Still it all seems to fall on deaf ears.

It seems the majority of Britains are still content to bury their heads regarding retirement savings whilst at the same time splurging on the latest phones, subscriptions, frothy coffees, foreign holidays and eating out.

Right now, the negativity is constrained to the comments section, but I also realise these people are our peer group and in 15-25 years time they are facing a bleak retirement whilst those like us who save are not.

Given the tendency for people to blame others/circumstances for their own misfortunes alongside suggesting others success was somehow a matter of luck or even immorality as opposed to hard work and fiscal prudence, are we facing a retirement where out hard saved for nice cars, holidays, meals and general lifestyle attract negativity (Or in the case of nice cars even vandalism)

Interesting point, but in essence I agree, although I think we're heading to  society where retirement is seen as anti-social, and basically people being lazy.  I am due to retire at the end of next week, aged 60. The reaction from most is positive, with lots of 'lucky you' or 'you won't regret it' messages....but also the odd 'so we'll work to keep you going' swipes. I don't even bother to explain that my pension is private, paid into by me and my 3 different employers throughout my life and that I'm 6 or 7 years from drawing the SP. However I see a society where 'hard work' is seen as the mark of a person and where people are currently being 'freed' to work on as long as they like. As that 'freedom' becomes normalised I can foresee a time when it becomes an expectation or duty to work later, if you don't want to be ostracised by society.  There are already murmurings , maybe unwitting ones, from mainstream media outlets and social media influencers describing pensioners as being on benefits, rather than the SP being an entitlement and a symbol of a civilised society looking after those who have worked for 40 plus years. In many other societies they respect their older memebers and look after them, whereas in 'blighty' we seem to be heading down a reverse Victorian ethos whereby instead of sending kids down mines or up chimneys, we expect older people to pick up the slack and work in jobs that others don't want. I do realise how lucky I am, having paid into pension from aged 18, which was mandatory in the old nationalised electricity supply industry. I resented it massively at the time as it was 6% of my salary and I'd rather have spent it down the pub, but now...42 years later I realise how sensible it was, and how lucky I was to be 'forced' into it. I am really looking forward to retirement, albeit with what I assume is normal trepidation after 43 unbroken years of working, and I will vociferously defend my right to retire and see out the rest of my life doing stuff I want to. I genuinely feel for younger people today (I have 2 daugters in their 20s) and whether retirement will be something they can ever do, but if they can't, it won't be the fault of my generation. It will be the fault of a society governed to know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

If that turns out to be the case, being a contrarian I would revel in being stigmatised. 

I bet nobody ever got to their death-bed and surrounded by their loved ones, uttered the phrase with their dying gasp “I wish I’d worked more”.

Enjoy your retirement; you’ve earned it. 

Flugelhorn

@grocerjack

Must say if anyone ever did the "we're working to keep you" I just reply "yes, great isn't it - keep going - toodleloo!" -

Workerdrone

Flugelhorn said:

@grocerjack

Must say if anyone ever did the "we're working to keep you" I just reply "yes, great isn't it - keep going - toodleloo!" -

Ooh! Imagine there blood pressure thinking "there's not a thing I can do about it!" :-:smiley:

grocerjack

Flugelhorn said:

@grocerjack

Must say if anyone ever did the "we're working to keep you" I just reply "yes, great isn't it - keep going - toodleloo!" -

Oh I so want to say that, but I fond at my age it is better to hold back a bit on replies like that ....although never say never...

Flugelhorn

grocerjack said:

Flugelhorn said:

@grocerjack

Must say if anyone ever did the "we're working to keep you" I just reply "yes, great isn't it - keep going - toodleloo!" -

Oh I so want to say that, but I fond at my age it is better to hold back a bit on replies like that ....although never say never...

I just found it unbelievably cheeky of people to actually comment on me retiring and my pension - they hadn't worked as long as I had and hadn't trained as long either or indeed paid out the bucket loads of tax that I had over the years to fund other people's pensions. 

zagfles

Flugelhorn said:

grocerjack said:

Flugelhorn said:

@grocerjack

Must say if anyone ever did the "we're working to keep you" I just reply "yes, great isn't it - keep going - toodleloo!" -

Oh I so want to say that, but I fond at my age it is better to hold back a bit on replies like that ....although never say never...

I just found it unbelievably cheeky of people to actually comment on me retiring and my pension - they hadn't worked as long as I had and hadn't trained as long either or indeed paid out the bucket loads of tax that I had over the years to fund other people's pensions. 

It happens the other way round too - the number of times on a Christmas do with retired ex-colleagues they've said stuff like "keep paying into the pension"! That plus the classic "I don't know how I found time to work"

SMcGill

I find it interesting that so far nobody (that I can see) has mentioned envy working the other way yet. Envy is maybe too strong, but there have been enough threads on CETV and insistent clients to suggest that not everyone on a DB pension thinks their grass is greener!

NedS

SMcGill said:

I find it interesting that so far nobody (that I can see) has mentioned envy working the other way yet. Envy is maybe too strong, but there have been enough threads on CETV and insistent clients to suggest that not everyone on a DB pension thinks their grass is greener!

Seduced by very large sums of money and a sense that markets only ever go up. To each their own.

fly-catchers

I found when I hit 60 many colleagues said they were surprised I was still there and why hadn't I retired. When I finally went at 63 the same people were shocked saying how can you afford to go! My reckoning is they thought they were winding me up at 60 thinking there is no way he can go. But I could have, but chose to stay! And these are the same people who dismissed my advice of putting as much money as you could afford into AVC's. No rather smoke, drink, gamble it away. Each to his own!    

SMcGill

Seduced by very large sums of money and a sense that markets only ever go up.

That may well be sometimes true for some people. I have a DB pension myself. As a single person and a smoker, the maths might suggest I would be better off with a DC pension. My point is that there are benefits and drawbacks to each, so envy in either direction seems pointless.