CCJ to old address whilst partner was out of the country!!

Le_Kirk

Cunners316 said:

Coupon-mad said:

To stop them later using the old address to get a secret CCJ behind your back for £250 ish, ruining your credit rating.

I'm confused, they've done that already! On Feb 26th this year.

OK, that's good, I didn't read back trough the whole thread.  Better to have too many reminders than not enough .............. or any.

Cunners316

Coupon-mad said:

To stop them doing that again, once you get the CCJ set aside.  Unlikely but you must never let a PPC keep an old address in their database.

Ah ok, get it now. Mant thanks.
I've sent of the SAR so will wait to see what returns. A bit concerned as the 10th November was touted as the day they were threatening to start bailiff procedures etc.

Coupon-mad

Where are you with the set aside application?

Cunners316

Apologies for the late reply. So we went for an SAR disclosure from BW Legal as we honestly had no idea about any letter or CCJ proceedings etc etc and wanted to see just what had been going on. We sent the SAR email on 18th October. By the end of the months grace we had received a copy of the letters only that they claim to have sent, most of which had gone to the wrong address originally.
So today we have made a complaint to the ICO about them and their handling of the data and also emailed them again requesting them to follow the SAR rules, informing them that a complaint has been made.
They. BW Legal that is, have also sent a threatening letter saying if full payment is not made by the 27th November they will hand it over to County Court Bailiffs. In the email to them I have respectfully asked they hold o ff this action until they have fulfilled their SAR obligations and given us a chance ot review the documents. I have no doubt they will not do this so will wait to see if anyone knocks on the door for money.
Should we now move forward with the set aside, even though we have zero information on this, we still havent even seen a copy of the alleged ticket!!

Coupon-mad

If you are relying on CPR 13.3 for your set aside, you are probably now too late.  You can't do it like this. You were required to act promptly.

A SAR doesn't go to the third part solicitor; they don't hold data about the parking charge. The PPC does.

The Defendant didn't need to know anything about the parking charge to apply for a set aside, because your application is not about defending the PCN claim.

You can hopefully still use CPR 13.2 if the claim was defectively served to an old address because there is no requirement to 'act promptly' for that situation.  But you still didn't need a SAR and should never have waited.

A set aside is not about the PCN.

Crack on with the application you should have done weeks ago or you will get bailiffs.

Base it on CPR 13.2 with 13,3 as a fall back and do it in November (this week) so it looks more prompt than a December application would. Read at least 10 other set aside threads to learn what to do and how to word it all, and what to attach to the form.

KeithP

Cunners316 said:

So we went for an SAR disclosure from BW Legal as we honestly had no idea about any letter or CCJ proceedings etc etc and wanted to see just what had been going on. We sent the SAR email on 18th October. By the end of the months grace we had received a copy of the letters only that they claim to have sent, most of which had gone to the wrong address originally.

What else were you expecting from BWL?

The suggestion was that you send a Subject Access Request to the parking company.

Cunners316

I may have got confused slightly then here, I was of the undserstanding you needed to know what the charge was before you apply to set aside? Ok, my mistake. I'll crack on with the set aside application today. 

Jenni_D

You STILL haven't done it yet? Why didn't you do it a week ago when @Coupon-mad advised you to? Are you only popping back to this board once a week? 🙄

Cunners316

Ok so an update. We finally got the SAR stuff (late) and put in the set aside claim. We have a date of next Friday, 6th April for court. 

BW Legal sent their defence basically blaming us totally and saying they did nothing wrong, interestingly saying it is not feasible for them to send out CCJ dates/claims by recorded/signed for and also admitting they had had no response from us at all since the ticket was issued 4 years ago. They also blamed my wife for leaving the country without letting them know(?). 

My interesting point is this, one of the pieces sent by them as evidence (but never sent in the SAR) was a picture of the sign for the parking. The alleged ticket was in 2017 and the sign says the driver would be liable for the ticket. Now, we have never told them who the driver was, it wasn’t my wife but they proceeded against her anyhow. 

Does this have a bearing in anything as in my mind they have prosecuted the wrong person. I may be wrong but I remember something about this driver/registered keeper thing from a few years ago and I know there was a change but I don’t remember the year etc. 

Either way I am definitely going to mention it in court as another example of them just not caring to check anything before handing out ccj’s. 

The rest of their defence lies on us not acting promptly after the ccj (we didn’t know about it for 6 months!) and that they didn’t harass us by trying to send in bailiffs the week we said we were going to appeal for a set aside. 

It’s going to be an interesting day for sure. 

Coupon-mad

6th May?  Is it an in-person hearing?  Are you planning to accompany the Defendant?

Detail is important and I worry about this case, as the wrong thing is being said/done a bit too often for us to feel entirely confident that you are well prepared: e.g. delaying the set aside application was a mistake and it's not clear who the Claimant is because you are only mentioning BW Legal now.

Other concerns:

There is no 'prosecution' involved.

It isn't relevant that the sign (which is not BW Legal's sign) says the charge will be the liability of the driver, because in the first 28 days, that is always the case.  In the instance of the parking event, that sign is correct and the alleged contract is indeed formed with the driver (at that stage).

The Claimant is not BW Legal.

The Defendant didn't get the SAR from BW Legal either, surely.  As discussed earlier, the SAR is not sent to the solicitor, it goes to the Claimant.  The Defendant needs to know this isn't about BW Legal.

Has the Defendant read and understood the different positions of CPR 13.2 and CPR 13.3, in case she gets accused of not acting promptly enough (because you delayed the set aside application)?  Hoping the Defendant knows the answer to that, as I explained a few months ago (above)? 

Does the Defendant know whether the PPC has complied with the POFA to transfer liability by law (as they can, but only under certain circs) from the driver to the keeper?  You could be right that she isn't liable but haven't seemed to have nailed that one way or the other, unless it's way back earlier in the thread.

I had to look back to your first post last October, to find that PPC Claimant is UKPPO.  They may or may not have used the POFA to transfer liability (depends mainly on the Notice to Keeper wording) but it's a little late to be looking at this now, if it wasn't covered earlier in this thread.

Another worry is that we don't know what the WS said or what evidence went with it to show that the Defendant had moved and was 'there to be found'.  Was this all covered in the WS?  ...and BW Legal were not named by mistake, as the Claimant?

It feels like we don't know enough about your case to help you, and by only popping back here every few months, you might be missing important information. Does the Defendant know about the Government's new Code of Practice, published in February?  Not that it is retrospective - but in the Ministerial foreword, Neil O'Brien MP declared the false added 'debt recovery' £60 or £70 imaginary costs that enhance these baseless claims, as 'designed to extort money from motorists'.