Is there money to be made in renting?

sourpuss2021

There's no money to be made in renting.  But there is in letting!

funnyvideo

What worries me is not knowing how much longer I can command the sort of salary I'm getting now. 

As for being entitled for wanting to buy when finishing university, that's exactly what people were doing when I graduated. Had I been content with the non-IT job I was doing at the time I'd have bought myself. I may have been making peanuts but prices were a lot cheaper and pretty much anyone could get a mortgage at the time.

I would have been able to buy earlier had I moved out of London to the commutable town I'd previously lived in, but a season ticket x 2 costs more than my mortgage.

[Deleted User]

hazyjo said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

SpiderLegs said:

You can pretty much guarantee that when all these people get their hands on the brand spanking new builds that rigoloth thinks evil LLs are going to pay for, he will then move on to demanding that another set of people who have more stuff than he would like have to pay for his improverished pals’ new roof, bigger telly, holidays in Marbella ….etc.

The joys of soundbite socialism….

For all of capitalism flaws, it has one simple rule, Work make money, work smarter, get more money, most of all better yourself.

The American Dream. Work hard and you can make it.

It's a lie. In reality who your parents are counts for a hell of a lot, just to start with.

Hard word is often not rewarded. For example, productivity has been steadily increasing but wages have not. The extra profit from that hard work has gone to the employers, not the staff. Employers aren't there to reward your efforts, they are trying to extract the maximum amount of work for the minimum amount of cost.

Sometimes, like right now, the market favours the workers and wages rise a bit. But most of the time that's not the case. It's worse for younger people. Their parents did better than their parents, they saw their incomes rise, got decent pensions, and were able to own property that increased to multiples of what they paid for it. They burned all the oil without a care for the consequences.

Younger generations look at that, see that all the opportunities are drying up and that they are expected to fund care and pensions without much prospect of having any themselves. Boomers tell them to work hard and give up the iPhone, but it's all nonsense. Anyone can plainly see that things are less affordable now than they ever were, property being the one of the worst.

And this is before we deal with climate change.

So are you advocating we should all give up and live on benefits and hand outs?

You only get out of life what you put in. So if you better yourself, get good qualifications and a good job and rise through the ranks, seems a reasonable thing to do. Indeed in America and here, people work 2-3 jobs at a time to save money for a better tomorrow

What may or may not happen with taxes, previous generations, e.t.c is not something you have control, the notion of the last generation had it better, so what, how does that help you now? Being miserable about it and not doing anything about it is self defeatist attitude to have

What you have control over is your own destiny and a choice what to do in life. Make life comfortable for yourself and get self sustainable financially. Or live on the bread line and always complaining about low benefits, poverty and migrants taking up work, you won't do. 

How exactly do you get from "the system is stacked against people and work is not properly rewarded" to "we should all live on benefits"?

You say "make life comfortable for yourself" like it's easy, or even possible for a lot of people. They don't have the opportunities you did, those opportunities have been taken away. Doubtless you will now say "make your own opportunities", another meaningless bit of feel-good advice with no practical solutions to these problems.

but if you don't try you won't know, this defeatist attitude also doesn't help and excuses come thereafter. 

Opportunities that came with one's own ambitions, will power and most of all unwillingness to live on the breadline and poverty. 

I never said it was easy, you don't get promoted from day 1, sacrifices, long hours, little to luxuries e.t.c.

One thing I will agree, yes no matter how hard you try, you may not get as much money as you want or in a position to be super comfortable, but unlike the lottery, it will be much better odds and you might learn more life lessons on the way.  Every little helps and even a few hundred/ thousand extra in money every year goes along way to keep people comfortable. 

Practical solutions, well don't P%$$ up school and work at it, you may not get all A's but if you give up from the day you go to school and moan saying the older generation had it good, your not going to get anywhere in life  are you?

I am not even 40 and I don't hold no grudge to the older generation, they had their own problems, remember interest rates being double figures?

Giving yourself excuses and making yourself feel good for claiming benefits and giving up without trying is not great either

instead of letting the system control you, build yourself and adapt around the system and let it work for you. You think Successful entrepreneurs gave up before starting? they had to front costs early on and struggled. 

Average house price in the UK is over £270k, so to buy an average house on a 4.5x salary multiplier you need to be earning at least £60k and have £27k saved for a 10% deposit. So about double the average salary and 12.5 years of the average monthly household savings. At the moment monthly price rises are 25x the average monthly household savings.

Not many go straight in with an average house though. Most FTBs will be starting off with small flats. We've all been there, I had 2 to start off with. It took many years to get a semi with a driveway! Can't compare what a couple in their 50s might buy against a 20 year old single FTB on a starting salary. Sorry if I've gone off track, I just wanted to mention it.

Not many FTBs are earning average wages either. These days it takes two of them and help from parents/inheritance.

Remember also that the average price is actually well below what a small flat or 2 bed house costs in many parts. Also keep in mind that due to biology people wanting a family can't just wait until their 50s to buy a 3/4 bed house.

Flats are a problem these days with the cladding and other fire safety problems. Many FTBs are getting wiped out by massive bills.

[Deleted User]

csgohan4 said:

boxer234 said:

[Deleted User] said:

When folk complain about house prices being unaffordable, I am curious to drill down into their personal circumstances. 

A fairly large percentage of those who feel priced out will be from London and unwilling to relocate to an area with more moderate house prices. It's not an ideal world. My relatives of the baby boomer generation, some of them emigrated to Australia for work. I've moved within the country more than once.

And what if you can’t get a similar job ? So end up earning less? It really depends on your line of work.  And if everyone decides to up sticks I’m assuming you don’t need nurses, teachers and police in London ?  It is fact that house prices have risen above wage rises.  It is harder to buy now than 20 years ago.  

Thing is life is full of choices, you can't afford to live or buy in the area you want, do you struggle on and keep moaning or move somewhere else where it is more affordable?

My parents worked in the hospitality business and couldn't afford to live and work in London, so they moved up north to Manchester and saved a bit more money to buy a house that was more comfortable than a box room in a grotty part of London

People still have low wage jobs and still live in London in box rooms and it is their choice. But when the same people complain they can't buy a house and demand/moan about not being able to buy London priced houses when does it become entitlement or life choices?

I would love to live in London but I can't afford the house prices on my current salary. Life choices

Moving doesn't work. There aren't good paying jobs in cheap areas, that's why they are cheap.

[Deleted User]

csgohan4 said:

I moved out of London because I couldn't afford to save a deposit. Cost of living there was too high for me. 

So I moved out and able to buy a much larger house for the price of a box room in London. If you are unwilling to move from an expensive area, then you have to accept the challenges of getting a house there. But no... people still moan and think they are entitled to live in expensive areas.

I mean i would love to live in Kensington/Knightsbridge. But I would quickly go bankrupt and end up in a worse place. 

The obsession with buying when your young amazes me. How can you buy a house when you finish UNI? Your starter salary is peanuts compared to your promotion one. 


Took more than 15 years to buy a house and renting to get there. The entitlement amazes me

You were lucky. House prices rose £25k in the last year, that's way beyond what most people can save.

SpiderLegs

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

I moved out of London because I couldn't afford to save a deposit. Cost of living there was too high for me. 

So I moved out and able to buy a much larger house for the price of a box room in London. If you are unwilling to move from an expensive area, then you have to accept the challenges of getting a house there. But no... people still moan and think they are entitled to live in expensive areas.

I mean i would love to live in Kensington/Knightsbridge. But I would quickly go bankrupt and end up in a worse place. 

The obsession with buying when your young amazes me. How can you buy a house when you finish UNI? Your starter salary is peanuts compared to your promotion one. 


Took more than 15 years to buy a house and renting to get there. The entitlement amazes me

You were lucky. House prices rose £25k in the last year, that's way beyond what most people can save.

House prices rising by 25k does not mean people need to save an additional 25k

[Deleted User]

SpiderLegs said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

I moved out of London because I couldn't afford to save a deposit. Cost of living there was too high for me. 

So I moved out and able to buy a much larger house for the price of a box room in London. If you are unwilling to move from an expensive area, then you have to accept the challenges of getting a house there. But no... people still moan and think they are entitled to live in expensive areas.

I mean i would love to live in Kensington/Knightsbridge. But I would quickly go bankrupt and end up in a worse place. 

The obsession with buying when your young amazes me. How can you buy a house when you finish UNI? Your starter salary is peanuts compared to your promotion one. 


Took more than 15 years to buy a house and renting to get there. The entitlement amazes me

You were lucky. House prices rose £25k in the last year, that's way beyond what most people can save.

House prices rising by 25k does not mean people need to save an additional 25k

Depends. If they were already at the limit of the salary multiplier offered by many lenders then they need £25k. If not they can mortgage some of it and the deposit goes up as a proportion.

Assuming they can mortgage all of it and put down a 10% deposit then they need to save £210/month just to stand still. Average monthly household savings in the UK are £180. Yes it's averages blah blah but it's undeniably a disaster for many FTBs.

SpiderLegs

[Deleted User] said:

SpiderLegs said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

I moved out of London because I couldn't afford to save a deposit. Cost of living there was too high for me. 

So I moved out and able to buy a much larger house for the price of a box room in London. If you are unwilling to move from an expensive area, then you have to accept the challenges of getting a house there. But no... people still moan and think they are entitled to live in expensive areas.

I mean i would love to live in Kensington/Knightsbridge. But I would quickly go bankrupt and end up in a worse place. 

The obsession with buying when your young amazes me. How can you buy a house when you finish UNI? Your starter salary is peanuts compared to your promotion one. 


Took more than 15 years to buy a house and renting to get there. The entitlement amazes me

You were lucky. House prices rose £25k in the last year, that's way beyond what most people can save.

House prices rising by 25k does not mean people need to save an additional 25k

Depends. If they were already at the limit of the salary multiplier offered by many lenders then they need £25k. If not they can mortgage some of it and the deposit goes up as a proportion.

Assuming they can mortgage all of it and put down a 10% deposit then they need to save £210/month just to stand still. Average monthly household savings in the UK are £180. Yes it's averages blah blah but it's undeniably a disaster for many FTBs.

You commented about house price rises from last year. People who were offered a mortgage at the limit of salary multiple twelve months ago, have presumably already bought their house and are now likely on a fixed rate of interest and have on paper benefitted from the 25k increase in prices and are no longer at the limit of salary multiples.

[Deleted User]

SpiderLegs said:

[Deleted User] said:

SpiderLegs said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

I moved out of London because I couldn't afford to save a deposit. Cost of living there was too high for me. 

So I moved out and able to buy a much larger house for the price of a box room in London. If you are unwilling to move from an expensive area, then you have to accept the challenges of getting a house there. But no... people still moan and think they are entitled to live in expensive areas.

I mean i would love to live in Kensington/Knightsbridge. But I would quickly go bankrupt and end up in a worse place. 

The obsession with buying when your young amazes me. How can you buy a house when you finish UNI? Your starter salary is peanuts compared to your promotion one. 


Took more than 15 years to buy a house and renting to get there. The entitlement amazes me

You were lucky. House prices rose £25k in the last year, that's way beyond what most people can save.

House prices rising by 25k does not mean people need to save an additional 25k

Depends. If they were already at the limit of the salary multiplier offered by many lenders then they need £25k. If not they can mortgage some of it and the deposit goes up as a proportion.

Assuming they can mortgage all of it and put down a 10% deposit then they need to save £210/month just to stand still. Average monthly household savings in the UK are £180. Yes it's averages blah blah but it's undeniably a disaster for many FTBs.

You commented about house price rises from last year. People who were offered a mortgage at the limit of salary multiple twelve months ago, have presumably already bought their house and are now likely on a fixed rate of interest and have on paper benefitted from the 25k increase in prices and are no longer at the limit of salary multiples.

No, in the last 12 months, as in September 2020 to September 2021. Figures for October are not available yet.

In any case, this is of little consolation to anyone trying to buy now.

SpiderLegs

[Deleted User] said:

SpiderLegs said:

[Deleted User] said:

SpiderLegs said:

[Deleted User] said:

csgohan4 said:

I moved out of London because I couldn't afford to save a deposit. Cost of living there was too high for me. 

So I moved out and able to buy a much larger house for the price of a box room in London. If you are unwilling to move from an expensive area, then you have to accept the challenges of getting a house there. But no... people still moan and think they are entitled to live in expensive areas.

I mean i would love to live in Kensington/Knightsbridge. But I would quickly go bankrupt and end up in a worse place. 

The obsession with buying when your young amazes me. How can you buy a house when you finish UNI? Your starter salary is peanuts compared to your promotion one. 


Took more than 15 years to buy a house and renting to get there. The entitlement amazes me

You were lucky. House prices rose £25k in the last year, that's way beyond what most people can save.

House prices rising by 25k does not mean people need to save an additional 25k

Depends. If they were already at the limit of the salary multiplier offered by many lenders then they need £25k. If not they can mortgage some of it and the deposit goes up as a proportion.

Assuming they can mortgage all of it and put down a 10% deposit then they need to save £210/month just to stand still. Average monthly household savings in the UK are £180. Yes it's averages blah blah but it's undeniably a disaster for many FTBs.

You commented about house price rises from last year. People who were offered a mortgage at the limit of salary multiple twelve months ago, have presumably already bought their house and are now likely on a fixed rate of interest and have on paper benefitted from the 25k increase in prices and are no longer at the limit of salary multiples.

No, in the last 12 months, as in September 2020 to September 2021. Figures for October are not available yet.

In any case, this is of little consolation to anyone trying to buy now.

Than one wonders why you mentioned it….