New Allotment - Help on number of plants to grow

Tabby_cat

Hello All. Sorry for the long post.

So after a wait of 2 and a half years I've finally got my hands on an allotment. I've had it now for about 7 weeks, during which time I've been clearing the weeds, spreading manure, and covering with black plastic sheets to be ready for next year. I've a small veg garden at home which only gets about 4 hours of sun so I plan to grow salad leaves, spinach etc. there. Stuff which likes to bolt if left to full sun, like the allotment gets. I've found a useful tool on-line for planning my plot, VegPlotter https://vegplotter.com/  All good so far.

What I'm struggling with is advice on how many of each veg to plant/sow. I know you'll say, depends on what you like, but even after reading loads, I still can't decide. There's myself, OH, allotment friend and her OH, so 4 adults all meat eaters wanting, say, enough for 3 meals a week. I wouldn't mind freezing some for winter use but that's not essential. If I've got too many seeds/sets etc. I can give away to a couple of neighbours who also have allotments. 

I've ordered/got the following seeds and was going to group them as follows:

Bed 1
New Potatoes - not purchased seed potatoes yet - Not sure how many to get but think I'd like to try 2 or 3 different varieties. 

Bed 2
Onions sets (autumn planting)
Garlic
Leeks
Spring onions

Bed 3
Pea's
French beans
Runner beans
Broad beans
Pea beans

Bed 4
Brussels sprouts - for 3 adults
Purple Sprouting
Calabrese
Cabbage

Bed 5 - All other stuff
Carrots
Parsnips - for 3 adults
Kale
Courgette - not a favourite so using up old seeds. 
Fennel

The beds are all 6m long by 1-1.2m wide, except for the one ear-marked for the potatoes which is about 2.5m square. 

The on-line tool is great for showing the maximum I can fit in, but, I don't want to have too much of a glut, so I'm thinking a little of everything would be better. I seem to remember growing French beans in the past and never having enough for a side dish which was equally irksome.

So, please would you lovely people, comment on how many of the above I should aim for. I'm having a lovely time planning but still scratching my head over numbers.

Also, if I've made a rooky error with the grouping of veg I'd appreciate all comments. I was going to move each bed along one each year. Are there any which shouldn't follow the previous if you see what I mean?

Many Thanks in advance.

RAS

It's really difficult. This year slugs have eaten almost everything before it got anywhere.

So normally I'd say 2 runner beans per person is enough but I know someone who planted a double row this spring. OK, only two plants actually produced beans but until very recently they've been struggling to actually pick the beans from two plants between two households, maybe two helpings each per week.

Elsewhere I'm currently picking a friend's French beans. It's worth doing a lot of research into varieties and growing the best for each purpose although it helps if you think of them as three crops, fresh, shellie and dry beans. Really good fresh French beans can be martyrs to slugs so pick off the first flower buds as the the beans are too close to the ground. One of her yellow beans make very good haricots but is useless as a fresh vegetable. I've got a couple of varieties that stand well even in drought and others that are so beany that they can only be used for dried beans.

How any sprouts do you want to eat a week? For how any weeks? One good plant will provide pickings for several over a month. so 2 or three plants may be enough.

Peas, plant a row and when they are 15 cm high, plant another row to get a continuous crop. Do the same with dwarf French beans. Or grow mangetout. They'll actually keep growing into the early winter unless they get shredded by storms, even if they are frozen at some point. If you've got a greenhouse, plant some shorter varieties in a hanging basket, out of reach of mice and voles.

twopenny

I would think plant twice as much as you think.

There are 4 of you - then some plants don't produce when you want them to and some over produce.

Then if you find you have more than you can use you can swap with another gardener to get other varieties or some you don't have for variety.

If you grow a little more than you think you'll need use different varieties so that you get to know the ones you like best and some surprises.

For instance tomatoes, I like San Marzano for salsa on pasta or making sauces, medium yellow ones for soup (touch of ginger and bay) and little ones to eat on the spot or salads. Then there's the bog standard for chutneys.

You can swap plants or seeds with your allotment neighbours so there's never waste.

As long as you follow the crop rotation in your plots everything else will follow - hopefully. You are competing with birds, slugs and snails and the good old British weather so I always plant twice as much as I need to account for some loss. Excess I give to neighbours.

One thing I notice is that you don't have any fruit. Maybe once you've got going? Raspberries are delicious straight from the cane and easy. Autumn fruiting can be grown in 2 sucessive seasons to produce all summer. Gooseberries can be grown as cordons along the edge of the beds and step over apples or short cordons. Strawberries too are easy and a small amount in a corner or in containers placed in teirs one on the other. I saw an excellent one made with canes and wire netting in tiers like a wedding cake. Takes up less space than in the ground and keeps the strawberries off the ground. Easy to net too.

Tabby_cat

Thanks both for your comments. It's so tricky and I'm sure I'll make a mess of it the first few years, but hopefully with your advice, not too disastrous. Any mistakes won't be complete disasters, because I can always learn from them.

@RAS
Noted regarding sprouts, I'm glad I was thinking along the same lines. The french beans I've got are a purple variety, which were a  recommendation from a neighbouring allotment holder, so I think they will be fine. Being the new-girl on the plot, I've been gifted lots of produce, so I've been able to "try before I buy". When you say for peas, plant a row, and then another, do you mean plant a full row 6m long row each time? That seems a lot to me, but that's why I'm asking your advice.

@twopenny
Thanks for the tips. I've already inherited some fruit. Autumn raspberries, rhubarb, a blackcurrant bush which I have had a lot of fruit from. Strawberries I already grow at home but can plant on some runners for the allotment. I'll look into a more vertical planting ideas for them. Thanks for the tip. I hadn't thought about step over apples. I always thought they were expensive to buy. Is there somewhere you'd recommend buying from or should I just visit my local garden centres?

Once again, many thanks.

greenbee

With French beans, I grow a mix of purple/green/yellow dwarf and then a mix of climbing beans - runners, mangetout bijou (love the flowers), yellow french and green flat beans. It provides plenty of variety and generally if one kind isn't happy, the others will be. I wouldn't grow a full 6m row in one go of anything as you'll get a glut (unless it's something you want a glut of!) - divide the space you've allocated to things that need succession planting up by the number of weeks you're going to sow them over, and then see how many plants in each space. 

@RAS - thanks for the reminder about peas in the greenhouse. I've just ordered some hanging baskets. And after this spring, I also acquired an insulation kit over the summer, so once the peppers are done I'll give it a good clean (no bugs last year - blight and whitefly this year) and then hopefully overwinter a couple of chillies and grow mangetout and the odd bit of baby salad to supplement the chard and perpetual spinach that I hope will keep me in greens over the winter. 

twopenny

For something as important as fruit trees I'd go to a nursery. Not as cheap as supermarkets but you know you're going to get what you want, that it will grow well. You will also get advice.
Don't be tempted by the supermarket ones for fruit. I've heard they don't come true to the label. I bought dwarf ones during covid. Turned out they aren't varieties we use in the uk and they had problems.
You'd best check with your allotment that you are allowed to grow them.
When you get surplus or'gifts' of produce remember you can pass them on or preserve them.
Freezing isn't great for runner beans, my friend used to salt hers and they stayed crisp. Chutneys delicious in winter, I make a chilli and tomato one, great for burgers or steak sandwiches.. Soups freeze well. Salsas for about 3 months.
Round the edge of your veg you can grow herbs. The woody ones are easy to dry and store. Hugely better than the stuff in jars. Silver and lemon thyme, very different. Chives and garlic chives flower at different times and attract bees. No maintenance!

RAS

@RASWhen you say for peas, plant a row, and then another, do you mean plant a full row 6m long row each time? That seems a lot to me, but that's why I'm asking your advice.

@twopenny
Thanks for the tips. I've already inherited some fruit. Autumn raspberries, rhubarb, a blackcurrant bush which I have had a lot of fruit from. 

Hi. Actually when I wrote that I was visualising  neighbour's plot; he's brilliant at successional sowing. A 5-6 foot row of low peas (3 foot) as that's the width of his beds but there's only two in the household. I tend towards climbing mangetout and peas.

Re step-overs, you can make them from maiden whips. Either bend them over gently to form a single "branch" or cut hard in late winter above two opposite buds facing the direction you want them to grow, tie growth to canes at 45 degrees and gently lower to horizontal. Leave the tips free, curling upwards if you want that stem to keep growing.

Or keep them as maidens, plant at 50 cm centres and grow as cordons.

Tabby_cat

Thanks all for you suggestions.

I've another fairly novice question regarding growing runner beans and pea's. As I'll be growing them together, and they both require support, (and here I'm thinking a single long frame, rather than round tee-pee shape) would you plant the beans one side of the frame and the peas the other? Or would you plant beans back-to-back at one end of the support and peas at the other? Or doesn't it matter and I'm over thinking it?

Once again, many thanks for you continued help to a novice.

RAS

Tabby_cat, which ever you want to do. But check out wind direction and place end to the wind, as full grown legumes have a huge sail area. Or use teepees, which are more wind resistant.

Tabby_cat

Thanks RAS for the reminder regarding the prevailing wind direction. I had thought about that, but reminders are always appreciated.

Is there an optimal spacing of canes for runner beans? I have one of those jute nets for the peas but I believe each runner will need it's own cane. So, if the runners require a12" spacing, could I space the canes on the pea side, double spacing at 24" and span the net between them? I'm just trying to work out how many canes to buy. Thanks again.