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URGENT Defence to send before 4pm
MummyBeal
Posts: 9 Forumite
New edit added 13.49 
I have now done points 2 and 3 following advice and lots more reading, but could really do with some support to see whether it is OK, so points 2 and 3 are below:
The facts as known to the Defendant:
2. It is admitted that the Defendant was the registered keeper of the vehicle in question at the time stated in the POC, but liability is denied. Whilst it is possible that the defendant could have been the driver of the vehicle in question, the 'parking charge', was issued almost 5 years ago. It would surely be unreasonable to expect The Defendant to recall their whereabouts on an unremarkable date almost half a decade prior, or even recall who would have been driving on said date, in a vehicle that had multiple drivers.
3.1 Regardless of the expectation to recall whereabouts as in point 2, The Defendant is unlikely to have been the driver on the POC date, with historical location tracking showing The Defendant in a location at least 7.8 miles from St Mary's Gate Retail.
3.2 Further, keeper liability is denied, in that a compliant Notice to Keeper (‘NTK’) was not properly served in strict accordance with paragraph 9 of the of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 ('the POFA) and due to the lack of adequate notice of the parking charge and lack of any 'relevant contract or obligation'.
3.3 The Defendant moved house on 14 May 2020. Mail forwarding was set up in a timely fashion and details with DVLA were updated accordingly, long before both vehicle control services and DCB legal on 31 August 2021, via telephone, stated that The Defendant should have been in receipt of a 'letter before claim' , at least 30 days prior to receiving the 'claim form'. It is denied that this document was received, despite The Defendant having registered correct details with DVLA. It has not been confirmed as to what delivery service was used by the Claimant, but as the 'claim form' was received by standard Royal Mail, it is assumed that no guaranteed or signed for delivery service was used for the 'letter before claim'.
I have also posted these in the comments
Previous post info:
Hi,
I'm really struggling here. I have a ccbc claim form from dcbl on behalf of vcs. For a ticket I apparently got on 18/10/2016!.
Regardless, I cannot remember, I had 2 tickets from other companies in the same year (yes I know), and reminders for those received separately etc. Aside from this , I can categorically confirm that the letter before claim was not received. I have been in every day pretty much due to ill health since then. Nor has any other correspondence been received since moving to my current address in May 2020. As such, I have no evidence. I don't know if I was the driver. I don't know what time the car was there, if it was me or my husband for work. What the signs were like at the time, if there will be any pictures that could evidence who was driving etc. Its St Mary's Gate retail Park sheffield. Pretty sure I can gather now from other posts that they are only pursuing these to ccbc due to lack of funds over covid...why wait 5.5 years otherwise...that in itself makes me annoyed. But no good of a defense.
So I'm stuck. I've read EVERYTHING I can, but can only retain so much info with my brain fog.
This is my para 2 and 3 so far, but where do I go from there? What else do I even put?
Claim form date was 16 Aug. So issue date 20/21?
2. It is admitted that the Defendant was the registered keeper of the vehicle in question but liability is denied. Whilst it is possible that the defendant could have been the driver of the vehicle in question, the 'parking charge', was issued almost 5 years ago. It would surely be unreasonable to expect the defendant to recall their whereabouts on a date so historical, or even recall who would have been driving on said date, in a vehicle that had multiple drivers.
3. Upon calling both vehicle control services and DCB legal on 31 August 2021, it became clear that the Defendant should have been in receipt of a 'letter before claim' , at least 30 days prior to receiving the 'claim form'. It is denied that this document was received and as such, the Defendant has not had the opportunity to make a subject access request. It is further denied that any correspondence has been received regarding this 'parking charge', so a subject access request would have been of utmost importance in determining an accurate line of defense or admittance in an degree. It has not been confirmed as to what delivery service was used by the Claimant, but as the 'claim form' was received by standard Royal Mail, it is assumed that no guaranteed or signed for delivery service was used for the 'letter before claim'.
Regardless of whether appropriate evidence is presented by the claimant, liability continues to be denied.
I have now done points 2 and 3 following advice and lots more reading, but could really do with some support to see whether it is OK, so points 2 and 3 are below:
The facts as known to the Defendant:
2. It is admitted that the Defendant was the registered keeper of the vehicle in question at the time stated in the POC, but liability is denied. Whilst it is possible that the defendant could have been the driver of the vehicle in question, the 'parking charge', was issued almost 5 years ago. It would surely be unreasonable to expect The Defendant to recall their whereabouts on an unremarkable date almost half a decade prior, or even recall who would have been driving on said date, in a vehicle that had multiple drivers.
3.1 Regardless of the expectation to recall whereabouts as in point 2, The Defendant is unlikely to have been the driver on the POC date, with historical location tracking showing The Defendant in a location at least 7.8 miles from St Mary's Gate Retail.
3.2 Further, keeper liability is denied, in that a compliant Notice to Keeper (‘NTK’) was not properly served in strict accordance with paragraph 9 of the of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 ('the POFA) and due to the lack of adequate notice of the parking charge and lack of any 'relevant contract or obligation'.
3.3 The Defendant moved house on 14 May 2020. Mail forwarding was set up in a timely fashion and details with DVLA were updated accordingly, long before both vehicle control services and DCB legal on 31 August 2021, via telephone, stated that The Defendant should have been in receipt of a 'letter before claim' , at least 30 days prior to receiving the 'claim form'. It is denied that this document was received, despite The Defendant having registered correct details with DVLA. It has not been confirmed as to what delivery service was used by the Claimant, but as the 'claim form' was received by standard Royal Mail, it is assumed that no guaranteed or signed for delivery service was used for the 'letter before claim'.
I have also posted these in the comments
Previous post info:
Hi,
I'm really struggling here. I have a ccbc claim form from dcbl on behalf of vcs. For a ticket I apparently got on 18/10/2016!.
Regardless, I cannot remember, I had 2 tickets from other companies in the same year (yes I know), and reminders for those received separately etc. Aside from this , I can categorically confirm that the letter before claim was not received. I have been in every day pretty much due to ill health since then. Nor has any other correspondence been received since moving to my current address in May 2020. As such, I have no evidence. I don't know if I was the driver. I don't know what time the car was there, if it was me or my husband for work. What the signs were like at the time, if there will be any pictures that could evidence who was driving etc. Its St Mary's Gate retail Park sheffield. Pretty sure I can gather now from other posts that they are only pursuing these to ccbc due to lack of funds over covid...why wait 5.5 years otherwise...that in itself makes me annoyed. But no good of a defense.
So I'm stuck. I've read EVERYTHING I can, but can only retain so much info with my brain fog.
This is my para 2 and 3 so far, but where do I go from there? What else do I even put?
Claim form date was 16 Aug. So issue date 20/21?
2. It is admitted that the Defendant was the registered keeper of the vehicle in question but liability is denied. Whilst it is possible that the defendant could have been the driver of the vehicle in question, the 'parking charge', was issued almost 5 years ago. It would surely be unreasonable to expect the defendant to recall their whereabouts on a date so historical, or even recall who would have been driving on said date, in a vehicle that had multiple drivers.
3. Upon calling both vehicle control services and DCB legal on 31 August 2021, it became clear that the Defendant should have been in receipt of a 'letter before claim' , at least 30 days prior to receiving the 'claim form'. It is denied that this document was received and as such, the Defendant has not had the opportunity to make a subject access request. It is further denied that any correspondence has been received regarding this 'parking charge', so a subject access request would have been of utmost importance in determining an accurate line of defense or admittance in an degree. It has not been confirmed as to what delivery service was used by the Claimant, but as the 'claim form' was received by standard Royal Mail, it is assumed that no guaranteed or signed for delivery service was used for the 'letter before claim'.
Regardless of whether appropriate evidence is presented by the claimant, liability continues to be denied.
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Comments
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So claim form issue date was 16 August 2021 ?
What date was the AOS done ? Your MCOL claim history has the answers to both
Email a SAR to the DPO at VCS attaching a copy of the claim form as proof of I D under the GDPR law
A defence never has a weekend deadline , or a bank holiday , so maybe tomorrow at 4pm , depending on your answers
Pedant mode , there is no S in the word DEFENCE1 -
these are the dates on mcol.
Sorry about the defence bit, I'm usually a spelling bee! Brain fried here.
But if my defence is due tomorrow...how am I going to get the evidence before then? And how do I put the defence together without the evidence? Will it go on hold?0 -
Your Defence is due 33 days after the issue date , or 28 days after the service date , service date is 21st August , so 33 days after issue date was yesterday , but weekend is not valid , so 4pm tomorrow , 20th September
You won't obtain the evidence before tomorrow , but will need it in several months time at the WS stage
No evidence is submitted with the defence , it never is
Nothing will place the case on hold either1 -
OK, so I don't include anything evidence related on the defense.
So what's my defense? POFA and driver liability? Amounts added to claim?0 -
Still has a C in it , we don't use the USA spelling , especially not in a defenceMummyBeal said:OK, so I don't include anything evidence related on the defense.
So what's my defense? POFA and driver liability? Amounts added to claim?
As for 2 & 3 , no idea as we don't have enough information , plus depends if you are defending as keeper not driver , keeper and driver or keeper but driver unknown
POFA assists a non driving keeper , because VCS never comply with POFA , in which case use ut
POFA does not assist an admitted driver , it never has and never will , so lose it if they know or you admit it
No landowner authority and poor signage are already in the template defence , as is the spurious additional charges1 -
Sorry. I am trying here. Defence defence defence 😅🤦♀️.
Keeper unknown driver. I would have been on maternity leave then, and my husband worked nearby often. Totally average unassuming day I can't say it was me or not.
I haven't admitted to anything either.0 -
@Redx has already given you your Defence filing target date/time.To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look at the second post in the NEWBIES thread.Don't miss the deadline for filing a Defence.
Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an Acknowledgment of Service has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.2 -
Yes I've been looking at all these threads, but I can't figure out what my defense actually is. I have no idea who was driving. So do I really just amend 2 and 3 for what I know at present and the rest of the template speaks for itself?KeithP said:@Redx has already given you your Defence filing target date/time.To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look at the second post in the NEWBIES thread.Don't miss the deadline for filing a Defence.
Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an Acknowledgment of Service has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.0 -
will POFA apply when it states Defendant is liable as keeper or driver?
0 -
2 is admitted keeper , liability denied , the defendant does not know who was driving on the day in question due to multiple drivers using the vehicle and too long ago to be sure
No other explanations in 2 , so find a similar 2 and copy it verbatim
3 , and possibly 4 are the bespoke details applicable to your case , even if you have to renumber the rest of the unchanged Defence ( yes it speaks for itself ) , include POFA
This is a good example to crib from , although it's Highview , but they don't comply with POFA either1
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