2 year renovation across the road from us - NOISE & rent reduction?

DGDG

Hello,

We rent from a commercial landlord in London. Across the road from us, a massive construction project has just started, it is a two year project to convert a shopping centre into something more modern. The noise is constant and extremely loud, they are drilling (or whatever) non stop. We have double glazed windows which are excellent but they do very little to reduce the noise. It is so noisy today that it impacts on my telephone conversations with clients. With working from home this is quite challenging, but even if I wasn't working, this would be absolutely draining.

I could move, but I'd rather not as the location is perfect and I do not anticipate that all parts of this project are going to be this noisy, so if at all possible I would very much like to stay.

My question is whether I would be entitled to a reduction in rent? Landlord says no, as it's not their property/work site, so there is nothing that hey can do. I could of course try and negotiate with them, but before I do I'd like to understand what the praxis is in cases such as this.

Any advice would be very welcome. 

TripleH

Sadly, I'd be surprised if you could get a discount. When did you start renting (was it before you started working from home)? As the landlord says, the work is outside his control and influence and he has no say in when it is undertaken.

I got a discount on the last flat I rented whilst construction work was going on, but that was more to keep us quiet as cladding kept falling off part of the building (the group who built it also rented it out) but we didn't get a discount for other work going on in the building (or in fact warning of loud internal work despite a lot of people working from home).

turnitround

Why would you be entitled to a rent reduction?  It's very inconvenient but not the fault of the landlord.

If you owned your home and were paying a mortgage there would be no reduction.

Section62

DGDG said:

I could move, but I'd rather not as the location is perfect and I do not anticipate that all parts of this project are going to be this noisy, so if at all possible I would very much like to stay.

Sometimes putting up with stuff like this is what goes with living in a perfect location.  For other people's perfect location (say) in the countryside it could be putting up with combine harvesters running late into the night in the summer, followed by smelly muck being spread over the fields.

Realistically, anywhere in built-up London could be subject to ongoing construction noise for years at a time, and the parts of London where that is less likely to happen come with a commensurate price tag.

In essence you are hoping your landlord will pick up a bill to compensate you for the inconvenience caused by a third-party. This is optimistic, especially with a commercial landlord.

You might feel it is worth trying a claim against the developer(s) [but that would also be quite optimistic] - and if the development is the one I'm thinking of I believe the local council are involved too, if so a complaint to your local councillor might be worthwhile.

DGDG

turnitround said:

Why would you be entitled to a rent reduction?  It's very inconvenient but not the fault of the landlord.

If you owned your home and were paying a mortgage there would be no reduction.

Because if we move out, he won't get a new tenant to pay what we are currently paying. I'm not suggesting I am necessarily entitled to a reduction (although this would be the case in the country where I used to work) but from the landlord's perspective I would assume that it would also be to his advantage to have us stay, as they wouldn't have to worry about any gap between us and the next tenant (who would almost certainly be paying less than us due to these works)

user1977

DGDG said:

turnitround said:

Why would you be entitled to a rent reduction?  It's very inconvenient but not the fault of the landlord.

If you owned your home and were paying a mortgage there would be no reduction.

Because if we move out, he won't get a new tenant to pay what we are currently paying. I'm not suggesting I am necessarily entitled to a reduction (although this would be the case in the country where I used to work) but from the landlord's perspective I would assume that it would also be to his advantage to have us stay, as they wouldn't have to worry about any gap between us and the next tenant (who would almost certainly be paying less than us due to these works)

Sure, if there's actually an opportunity for the rent to be renegotiated then you could try using this as justification. Though that might work against you (or just lead to stalemate) if the landlord thinks market rents have generally been going up...

Shaztastic3000

the landlord has already said no, so why are you asking?

TripleH

Are you still in a fixed term contract? As it might be hard for you've up and leave early if you are especially if as you say, he will struggle to get tenants in paying the full rent.

Just per chance, this isn't the Elephant and Castle Shopping Centre is it?

I ask because I lived around that area and development work was on the cards/ planned back then. Regardless, it might be that your rent already factors in a disruption reduction already hence the landlord not wanting to agree further discounts,  the argument 'information was already in the public domain about these planned works,  not my fault if the prospective tenants didn't do their homework' could be his justification.

deannagone

I think its very unlikely you will be able to negotiate a discount. 

Can you move your office location to somewhere further away from the building site (opposite side of the flat etc?).  I would suggest using noiseless headphones as well (I use them, they cut outside sound out very well).  Won't help the other end hearing you but will improve you hearing them.  Sometimes you can get a noiseless headset but not sure how good they are.  Hopefully the really loud noise won't be constant all the time.

I just did a bit of googling.., apparently its possible to get accoustic curtains.  No idea how effective they are.  I know insulating curtains (if good quality) work well at keeping heat in/out of the house or I buy thick velvet curtains (I have both sorts in my house lol).  Perhaps you could get thick velvet curtains and an accoustic lining to help a bit more?  Might be worth a try.

Sorry there aren't better suggestions.

Section62

DGDG said:

Because if we move out, he won't get a new tenant to pay what we are currently paying. I'm not suggesting I am necessarily entitled to a reduction (although this would be the case in the country where I used to work) but from the landlord's perspective I would assume that it would also be to his advantage to have us stay, as they wouldn't have to worry about any gap between us and the next tenant (who would almost certainly be paying less than us due to these works)

I wouldn't want to gamble on that.

You are particularly affected because you are at home and working during the day.  The hours of work on a construction site in a city will be restricted to limit the impact on residents.

The next person looking for a flat who thinks that location is perfect might be someone who is out at work all day and won't be impacted by daytime noise.

If this is Elephant and Castle (as I suspected) the regeneration project has been in the making for a very long time.  Anyone really keen on moving to that location (which does have excellent transport links) is likely to have some awareness of the project and the associated risk of noise, before even viewing the flat.

TripleH

I left the elephant and Castle area 5 years ago and it was under development / regeneration then. The shopping centre was being slowly closed down back then, I had assumed they'd finished it all by now. If this is where you are sadly I think my "you should gave been aware of the work due to take place when you rented" argument will come into effect.

Further to Deannagone, we used a piece of blackout material and self adhesive velcro to secure it to a window, might be cheaper than a curtain?