John Lewis damaged and urinated on my property.

dil1976

Sorry but those scratches don't look consistent with something being dragged over the floor, they all look a little too random spread and no parallel ones neither?

Damiansc

dil1976 said:

Sorry but those scratches don't look consistent with something being dragged over the floor, they all look a little too random spread and no parallel ones neither?

Are you serious? Do you think it was caused by my cat? 
They tried to lift but couldn't so lifted and dragged and then spun it around in middle of hall to get it in kitchen.

dil1976

Yes deadly serious, here is a picture showing the scratches going in different directions.

ivavoucher

dil1976 said:

Yes deadly serious, here is a picture showing the scratches going in different directions.

I must be too trusting, the last thing I would have concluded after seeing the photos is that the OP is a liar but then I am not an expert on how scratches are formed on wooden floors by idiot delivery men with certain makes and models of fridges. Do your conclusions cover all makes of fridge? 

dil1976

ivavoucher said:

dil1976 said:

Yes deadly serious, here is a picture showing the scratches going in different directions.

I must be too trusting, the last thing I would have concluded after seeing the photos is that the OP is a liar but then I am not an expert on how scratches are formed on wooden floors by idiot delivery men with certain makes and models of fridges. Do your conclusions cover all makes of fridge? 

No just the ability to use my eyes, how would to continuous lines be formed by dragging something over it and go in different directions?

Damiansc

dil1976 said:

Yes deadly serious, here is a picture showing the scratches going in different directions.

I think you'll find if you look at the bigger picture that is a door way. This is where they tried to get it through but couldn't so took it back and spun it around in another doorway.
I'm not a delivery man, I'm a builder so use common sense and logic, the solution to me which I would have thought was obvious is to remove the fridge doors which take under 1 minute. The fridge even comes with a tool to do it! 

I actually removed an internal door for them to make it easier and took a day off for them to deliver but they didn't show on the date stated. They were 2 days late & unfortunately I had to be at my customers job.
 
Thank you for your forensic analysis. I really hope you're not a weapons inspector or pandemic scientific adviser though.

photome

Have JL seen all those photos. Your contract is with them so send them a LBA if you are getting no where

Manxman_in_exile

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

I don't think agreeing to take responsibility would mean they have no liability for negligence.

Obtain proof of the cost of repairing the damage and issue them a letter before action (templates on Google) with the proof attached. 

I'd forget the peeing in the garden bit, it caused no loss and whilst unpleasant your focus should be on the damage.  

Do this  ^^^^.

The delivery people have not executed the delivery service with reasonable care and skill and have negligently damaged your floor.  They were acting as agents for JL when they did this and JL should be responsible.

If you had contracted for a 3 man delivery team (and it seems you did) then if they turn up undermanned and give your GF an ultimatum "You need to agree to us continuing and possibly damaging your property - if you don't we'll leave it dumped outside" doesn't get them off the hook - it's not acceptable.

Make sure the quote is a reasonable one for the repair work required, and not inflated.  (I assume as a builder you can get a reliable quote fairly easily).

Is the fridge door dented too?  Is that because they failed to carry out another part of the contracted service - door removal?  (Is it likely to affect the fridge's performance in respect of insulation etc?)

Damiansc

Manxman_in_exile said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

I don't think agreeing to take responsibility would mean they have no liability for negligence.

Obtain proof of the cost of repairing the damage and issue them a letter before action (templates on Google) with the proof attached. 

I'd forget the peeing in the garden bit, it caused no loss and whilst unpleasant your focus should be on the damage.  

Do this  ^^^^.

The delivery people have not executed the delivery service with reasonable care and skill and have negligently damaged your floor.  They were acting as agents for JL when they did this and JL should be responsible.

If you had contracted for a 3 man delivery team (and it seems you did) then if they turn up undermanned and give your GF an ultimatum "You need to agree to us continuing and possibly damaging your property - if you don't we'll leave it dumped outside" doesn't get them off the hook - it's not acceptable.

Make sure the quote is a reasonable one for the repair work required, and not inflated.  (I assume as a builder you can get a reliable quote fairly easily).

Is the fridge door dented too?  Is that because they failed to carry out another part of the contracted service - door removal?  (Is it likely to affect the fridge's performance in respect of insulation etc?)

John Lewis has put me in touch with both panther logistics (not sure but I feel I'm doing their job.) Panther weren't interested other than saying the driver was dismissed after this incident. So we are back with JL regarding the damaged floor.

Yesterday LG got in touch and offered a replacement fridge (yes fridge was damaged also) they don't have the same model but will supply a similar one. They actually did admit the courier company is terrible with some horror stories but said they are the best of a very bad bunch.

I don't want to accept the fridge until we've agreed what will happen with damage to floor.  The consensus here seems to be that ultimately JL are responsible like I thought. 

I'm amazed a company like JL are so slow to deal with this.  Lots of good advice here though so thank you

macman

Consensus doesn't come into it. You clearly have no contract with either LG or Panther, they are merely subcontractors of JL, with whom you do have a contract. JL are 100% liable, end of. You should not have been fobbed off by JL into dealing with their subbies direct. There is no issue with accepting a replacement fridge as long as you make it clear in writing to JL hat this is not a full and final settlement and that you hold them liable for the floor damage.
The only possible grey area here is whether liability can be avoided by JL getting your g/f to verbally accept a 2 man delivery 'without liability'. As others have stated, a duty of care remains, and they clearly have failed to discharge it. Since the damage to the fridge and the floor arise from the same dereliction of that duty, by accepting one, they have surely accepted the other.
As a backup, you could even argue that, since the contract was made by you, not your g/f, she had no authority to agree to the 'revised delivery terms' anyway.
JL offshored much of their CS a few years back to cut costs and there are numerous accounts of how poor it now is. 
Just bung in an LBA to JL and take it from there. As long as you can quantify the damages claim (with a written quote) then your case is pretty much watertight in small claims, it simply isn't worth them defending it for a grand.