County Court Case - Gladstones acting for Euro Parking Services [Update - I WON]

mrdeepee

So, my missus has been getting letters about a PCN from Euro Parking Services since 2019, which she's been putting in the Recycling Bin. 3 days ago she received a Claim Form from County Court Business Centre, which got her into hysterics, and it is now beholden on me to sort out because she's lost her bottle and is arguing that the £265 being demanded should be paid, to avoid going to court.

Well, since I'd rather pass a kidney stone than hand over 265 notes to the charlatans, I have appointed myself as her Lay Representative to tackle this small claims case in the County Court.

The facts of the case are that from out of the blue, she received a PCN in the post saying she has to pay £100, because she stayed longer than the allotted time at a McDonalds car park, based on evidence from a recording of her vehicle entering and exiting the car park. This is a McDonalds restaurant we visit often and until she got the PCN, she had no idea there were parking restrictions there. Also, it could have been either of us driving, as neither of us can remember.

So far, I have sent the Acknowledgement of Service online, and I now have until September 7th to file my defence, and it is from this point that I will need your kind assistance.

Here are the makings of the defence I am considering:

(1) They have no idea who the driver was because in their Particulars of Claim, they referred to the Defendant as driver/keeper. We also don't remember who was driving, so not sure whether to craft a defence on the basis of being the keeper, driver or both.

(2) They're claiming a global sum of £160, which includes "contractual costs" of £60, and I understand Gladstones have already had a severe reprimand from a judge about this £60 charge, and had a case thrown out.

(3) I intend to pop round to the car park to have a look at the signs but I have no way of knowing if what I'll be looking it, are the same signs displayed there 2 years ago when this happened. Also, if they show a picture of the sign as part of their evidence in court, how do we know if they're the actual signs in place 2 years ago.

(4) How do I get to see the evidence they'll be relying on in court, because the only thing I've got to work with is the County Court Claim Form.

(5) Lastly, if this gets as far as a hearing, I presume that as her Lay Representative, I can do all the talking in court, and get her to sit there looking pretty, without saying a word.

Once I've had a few responses to the above, I'll put together my defence using the Defence Template & post it here or some feedback. Thanks in advance for what I'm sure will be some very valuable advice.

Redx

Even a loss in court would be less money , so  pointless paying !!

1 is change defence template paragraph 2 to say keeper but driver not known because multiple drivers can drive and it's an unremarkable day from a long time ago !!  Or similar

2 that is why a loss in court would be £60 less

3 try GSV and do a Google search for previous signage , plus the defendant puts the claimant to strict proof of the signs at the time of the incident, the location may have come up before

4 a SAR from the defendant to the DPO at the PPC will obtain their data , the rest of the claimant evidence comes in the WS bundle a few weeks before the hearing !!

5 in theory , yes , but she will have to answer any questions put to her directly , in the hearing

Chances are she will be at home with you , on a telephone conference call or video link like Teams , so unlikely to be in a courtroom !! It's rare since the pandemic started for any face to face hearing to take place

KeithP

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Upon what date did you file an Acknowledgment of Service?
Your MCOL Claim History will have the definitive answer to that.

Of course when I say 'you' or 'your' I mean the Defendant.

mrdeepee

Redx said:

4 a SAR from the defendant to the DPO at the PPC will obtain their data , the rest of the claimant evidence comes in the WS bundle a few weeks before the hearing !!

Thanks @Redx

If I make a SAR to the DPO of Euro Parking Services, I expect they'll take as long as they can to send it. I'm wondering if it'll get to me in time to be relevant to my defence.

mrdeepee

KeithP said:

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Upon what date did you file an Acknowledgment of Service?
Your MCOL Claim History will have the definitive answer to that.

Of course when I say 'you' or 'your' I mean the Defendant.

Date on County Court Claim is 04/08/2021 and the AoS was filed on 07/08/2021

Redx

mrdeepee said:

Redx said:

4 a SAR from the defendant to the DPO at the PPC will obtain their data , the rest of the claimant evidence comes in the WS bundle a few weeks before the hearing !!

Thanks @Redx

If I make a SAR to the DPO of Euro Parking Services, I expect they'll take as long as they can to send it. I'm wondering if it'll get to me in time to be relevant to my defence.

Probably not if a court claim is in progress , they have 30 days , everyone does , but the data is of more use at the WS stage in several months time

You will be told your deadlines when you answer KeithP

KeithP

mrdeepee said:

KeithP said:

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Upon what date did you file an Acknowledgment of Service?
Your MCOL Claim History will have the definitive answer to that.

Of course when I say 'you' or 'your' I mean the Defendant.

Date on County Court Claim is 04/08/2021 and the AoS was filed on 07/08/2021

I see you wrote earlier that you had until 7th September to file a Defence, but you are mistaken.

With a Claim Issue Date of 4th August, and having filed an Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 6th September 2021 to file your Defence.

That's over four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look at the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Don't miss the deadline for filing a Defence.

mrdeepee

Redx said:

Thanks @Redx

If I make a SAR to the DPO of Euro Parking Services, I expect they'll take as long as they can to send it. I'm wondering if it'll get to me in time to be relevant to my defence.

Probably not if a court claim is in progress , they have 30 days , everyone does , but the data is of more use at the WS stage in several months time

You will be told your deadlines when you answer KeithP

Will an SAR made to Euro Parking Services come back with everything we've been sent about this PCN, including letters from Gladstones, Debt Collectors, etc

Or will we have to make separate requests to each of them

Redx

Probably separate requests , but you need to ask them , not us

The important documents come from the DPO at the PPC

D_P_Dance

she's lost her bottle and is arguing that the £265 being demanded should be paid, 

An MP has suggested that some of these companies may have links tio organised crime.  Pay and you money could end up funding modern slavert and people smuggling.  Complain to her MP instead.  

Also, this sum is likely to contain an unlawful amount for debt collection, read this,

Excel v Wilkinson

At the Bradford County Court, District Judge Claire Jackson (now HHJ Jackson, a Specialist Civil Circuit Judge) decided to hear a 'test case' a few months ago, where £60 had been added to a parking charge despite Judges up and down the country repeatedly disallowing that sum and warning parking firms not to waste court time with such spurious claims.   That case was Excel v Wilkinson: G4QZ465V, heard in July 2020 and leave to appeal was refused and that route was not pursued.  The Judge concluded that such claims are proceedings with 'an improper collateral purpose'.   This Judge - and others who have since copied her words and struck dozens of cases out in late 2020 and into 2021 - went into significant detail and concluded that parking operators (such as this Claimant) are seeking to circumvent CPR 27.14 as well as breaching the Consumer Rights Act 2015.   DJ Hickinbottom has recently struck more cases out in that court area, stating: ''I find that striking out this claim is the only appropriate manner in which the disapproval of the court can be shown''.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/16qovzulab1szem/G4QZ465V Excel v Wilkinson.pdf?dl=0

mrdeepee

Hi guys,

I've taken a trip back to the carpark for some investigative work, and here are my findings:

Here is a 2:34 mins video of a vehicle Entering & Driving Through The Carpark, showing the view from inside the vehicle.

This is a close up of the sign at the entrance of the carpark





Next is a close up of one of the signs showing the terms of parking. Note that the signs are at least 8 feet up in the air




Any thoughts will be appreciated as I will be presenting these as part of my evidence to show that the signs weren't clear enough, to have been seen, understood and accepted by a motorist driving into the carpark, exiting the vehicle and entering the restaurant.