Solicitor won’t write letter of undertaking.

GDB2222

rose_T said:

We contacted the seller on Monday, we told him we can’t move forward as we genuinely can’t do anymore at this stage. 

We payed our deposit and asked our lender if they would accept the insurance which they came back and said no. 

So we said it is now up to you to tell your solicitor to get it sorted, cause it’s not us being picky this is going to be a problem to whoever he sells to even a cash buyer would be reluctant. So he said he would get in touch with his solicitor. 

I haven’t heard anything back since Monday so god knows what’s going on. But the sellers and their solicitor needs to sort it. If it wasn’t this property in the area we want I would have 100% pulled out months ago. We have been patient for over a year so they could sort out confirmation etc 

and see if their solicitor came back and said ok this is the story we have made contact with the bank and because it’s an old settled account they said it could take 4mths to track down we would say that’s absolutely fine we will wait. It’s the not knowing that’s the problem. And his attitude towards it. 

Have you, umm, thought of buying a different property?

[Deleted User]

@rose_T according to your previous threads the missives have been concluded and your solicitor has advised you to reject the indemnity policy. Is the seller not now in breach of contract? I’m specifically thinking of the clause..

The Seller is not aware of any encumbrances as defined in Section 9 of the 2012 Act affecting the Property which are not disclosed in the title to the Property.

Other than rejecting the indemnity policy what is your solicitor advising about the breech of contract? 

user1977

Lover_of_Lycra said:

@rose_T according to your previous threads the missives have been concluded and your solicitor has advised you to reject the indemnity policy. Is the seller not now in breach of contract? I’m specifically thinking of the clause..

The Seller is not aware of any encumbrances as defined in Section 9 of the 2012 Act affecting the Property which are not disclosed in the title to the Property.

Not quite - "encumbrances" in that sense are unregistered interests which might affect the title (e.g. leases, servitudes). The more relevant clause is:

17.6 The Seller's Solicitors will not provide any letter of obligation undertaking to clear the records of any deed, decree or diligence. However, the Seller shall procure that their Solicitors will grant a Letter of Undertaking obliging them to either (a) deliver within 28 days of the Date of Settlement to the Purchaser’s Solicitors a Discharge of any outstanding Standard Security granted by the Seller over the Property together with relative Land Registration Application Form or (b) exhibit within 35 days of the Date of Settlement a copy of the Title Sheet of the Property showing that any security disclosed in the Legal Report exhibited prior to settlement has been discharged.

(assuming the discharge isn't actually available at settlement)

rose_T

Lover_of_Lycra said:

@rose_T according to your previous threads the missives have been concluded and your solicitor has advised you to reject the indemnity policy. Is the seller not now in breach of contract? I’m specifically thinking of the clause..

The Seller is not aware of any encumbrances as defined in Section 9 of the 2012 Act affecting the Property which are not disclosed in the title to the Property.

Other than rejecting the indemnity policy what is your solicitor advising about the breech of contract? 

No I thought they were but they haven’t 

[Deleted User]

rose_T said:

Lover_of_Lycra said:

@rose_T according to your previous threads the missives have been concluded and your solicitor has advised you to reject the indemnity policy. Is the seller not now in breach of contract? I’m specifically thinking of the clause..

The Seller is not aware of any encumbrances as defined in Section 9 of the 2012 Act affecting the Property which are not disclosed in the title to the Property.

Other than rejecting the indemnity policy what is your solicitor advising about the breech of contract? 

No I thought they were but they haven’t 

If the missives have not been concluded then withdraw your offer and find somewhere else to buy. You appear to have reached an impasse with this one where your solicitor has advised you against the indemnity policy and the seller’s solicitor isn’t offering anything other than the indemnity policy. 

Edi81

Just checking they are dealing with the correct bank. 

If the security from 30 years ago says TSB this could be Lloyds Bank now and not current TSB. 

It’s probably best to check with both banks if they have any records. 

[Deleted User]

Edi81 said:

Just checking they are dealing with the correct bank. 

If the security from 30 years ago says TSB this could be Lloyds Bank now and not current TSB. 

It’s probably best to check with both banks if they have any records. 

Lloyds and TSB didn’t merge until 1995 and I don’t think there were any Lloyds Bank branches in Scotland before that. 

firebubble

You might also want to raise a complaint to the banking regulator, as that will put pressure on the bank (lloyds?) who has inherited the TSB and is being slow to come up with an answer. 

The reason this might work is that the bank is clearly having trouble finding the records - this puts them in breach of banking regulation, so they won't want to admit that they can't find the records to the regulator, and it's such a small amount that it's likely they will write it off and release the charge, just to make the case with the regulator go away.

user1977

firebubble said:

The reason this might work is that the bank is clearly having trouble finding the records - this puts them in breach of banking regulation, so they won't want to admit that they can't find the records to the regulator, and it's such a small amount that it's likely they will write it off and release the charge, just to make the case with the regulator go away.

I'm not sure it's necessarily the case that they should still have a record of the account, assuming it's one which was closed many years ago. They should however not be unreasonably delaying a request to discharge the security, unless they've found a good reason for retaining it.

rose_T

Thanks everyone, I have tried not to think about it over the past couple of days. 

We really want this property for a personal sentimental reason this is why we are still trying to buy and haven’t pulled out. 

There could be so many reasons why the selling solicitor has been reluctant. It could be the case that he believed we wanted a fast sale and thought the insurance was sufficient. If he came back and said look we are having trouble finding the account it may take a number of months, it wouldn’t scare us off as we are happy to wait and if need be extend our mortgage offer. 

We don’t need to worry about having to give notice etc as we are in a housing association property and the rent is less than our mortgage if we ever get it £270per month. 

It’s the limbo of not knowing exactly what’s happening. Think the reason I post a lot is just to let out frustrations with a little hope that someone may have had this experience and shed some light on how it worked out for them.

I do believe both solicitors are sticking to their guns and maybe there has been a relationship break down as I feel they can both be a bit snappy in emails to each other which may not help. So we are thinking to keep in more contact with seller to try and sort this out.