12 weeks notice is up... (a quick little question again)

General_Grant

getmore4less said:

frogga said:

Hello friends,

Holiday goes from 1st May to 30th April. He defo didn't have the other BH paid to him (Easter was in last years). If you are right and they did calculate it on 20 days, then yes, they do owe him the other May BH at least.

He started his 12 weeks notice pay on 24th May. He was getting SSP from Sept to March 27th and they did pay him some holiday pay at the end of March. He did not get a full year, he got 2 days less than that (26 days) so I am guessing you are exactly right that they calculated his holiday as a pro rate thing. He had no money from them in between 27th March and 24th May so did he not earn holiday for that period? HE was still an employee just not being paid.

He does not have an hourly rate, they have been paying him £126 a day for this 12 weeks notice period. 

This is quite confusing to me but I'm concentrating hard so keep telling me xxx

There are a couple of things in there ......

if he started 12 weeks on the 24th of May that makes W/E 15th Aug the last week. 

Why do you think his last day was 27July?

IF employed then he is entitled to 5.6 weeks holiday irrespective of any weeks not paid, you accrue based on time as an employee so if he was employed for the full holiday year 1 May 2020- 30 April 2021 dues the full 5.6 weeks. 

The average of the last 52 weeks to get a weeks holiday pay sorts out the amount due for a week(or part week) holiday.

This emphasised sentence is the only point I'm not sure about - because the sick pay would have been at a lower rate.  If no pay is received in a week, it doesn't count and you go back further to find a week in which a payment was made but I suspect that SSP would count as a payment and thereby reduce the daily rate.

Undervalued

frogga said:

Mr Frog is VERY keen to get some part time work as he is VERY bored at home and really wants to do SOMETHING. I would like to ask for a reference as he did nothing wrong. They dismissed him due to his health and their view was they could not accomadate his needs. Do I just ask for one and use it on each application? If we dont see what they have written, they could say not nice things about him and I would like to know!

Thank you friends x

To answer your other point above....

You cannot force an employer to provide a reference (except in a few regulated occupations) so they could, if they wish, either refuse or just ignore any request. "We are not willing to provide a reference for this person" is a perfectly lawful response but pretty damming!

If they do provide one it must be truthful and not deliberately misleading (and yes it is possible to be very misleading without straying from the truth)! The have a duty to be fair both to the employee and to the potential employer and could be held liable if they are not.

For this reason many employers these days only provide "bare bones" references confirming the dates of employment and little else.

It is generally possible to get sight of any reference by a subject access request under the GDPR although references do now have some protection from disclosure. Have a look at the Information Commissioner's website.

frogga

Thank you GG and UV both excellent points. They have been pretty unhelpful, but I dont think they would do anything so mean as to give him a bad reference? I worry that they would, but I really don't think they would? When Mr Frog's dad died at 2am he still went into work the next day so as to not let them down, and on the day of the funeral he did a quick job first as someone called in sick. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be so disloyal now?

We are in a very lucky position that he doesn'r have to work, so he can find a little part time job just to keep him useful. I think a school drop off type job would be excellent, or even an unpaid helper for a charity delivering people to places

Savvy_Sue

frogga said:

We are in a very lucky position that he doesn'r have to work, so he can find a little part time job just to keep him useful. I think a school drop off type job would be excellent, or even an unpaid helper for a charity delivering people to places

the only problem with both of those is that he has to be reliable. I'm not doubting that he is, in himself, a reliable person, but there is always the concern that his health problems might get the better of him. If he knows a day or two in advance that he's going downhill and won't be able to work, life becomes simpler, but if he ever just can't move at short notice then it's tricky if others are relying on you. 

However, another charity job he might consider is going round picking up donations, if he can manage that. 

frogga

Hello Sue, I hope you are well? I do understand your point. I would have to say though, that he has NEVER let work down, struggling with his illness or not. In the 14 years he worked for them he NEVER called in sick and was never late. When his AR was really bad, he twice had to get my grown up son and I to take him to the lorry at stupid o'clock in the morning to 'hoist' him into the cab, but he NEVER didn't show.

I'm thinking an 'easy' car driving/van driving job would be easy. Not being a multi drop courier or anything, but yes, maybe the picking up donations would be a good idea. He just wants to be useful and get out of the house.

getmore4less

General_Grant said:

getmore4less said:

frogga said:

Hello friends,

Holiday goes from 1st May to 30th April. He defo didn't have the other BH paid to him (Easter was in last years). If you are right and they did calculate it on 20 days, then yes, they do owe him the other May BH at least.

He started his 12 weeks notice pay on 24th May. He was getting SSP from Sept to March 27th and they did pay him some holiday pay at the end of March. He did not get a full year, he got 2 days less than that (26 days) so I am guessing you are exactly right that they calculated his holiday as a pro rate thing. He had no money from them in between 27th March and 24th May so did he not earn holiday for that period? HE was still an employee just not being paid.

He does not have an hourly rate, they have been paying him £126 a day for this 12 weeks notice period. 

This is quite confusing to me but I'm concentrating hard so keep telling me xxx

There are a couple of things in there ......

if he started 12 weeks on the 24th of May that makes W/E 15th Aug the last week. 

Why do you think his last day was 27July?

IF employed then he is entitled to 5.6 weeks holiday irrespective of any weeks not paid, you accrue based on time as an employee so if he was employed for the full holiday year 1 May 2020- 30 April 2021 dues the full 5.6 weeks. 

The average of the last 52 weeks to get a weeks holiday pay sorts out the amount due for a week(or part week) holiday.

This emphasised sentence is the only point I'm not sure about - because the sick pay would have been at a lower rate.  If no pay is received in a week, it doesn't count and you go back further to find a week in which a payment was made but I suspect that SSP would count as a payment and thereby reduce the daily rate.

ACAS guidance
https://www.acas.org.uk/checking-holiday-entitlement/calculating-holiday-pay#:~:text=If for any of the,usual pay for calculating holiday.

oh_really

Normal calculation for holiday pay is as though the individual would have been at work although I accept other arrangements may come into play here.