CONSERVATORY/BOUNDARY/RIGHT OF WAY

Norman_Castle

Does number three have independent access to their garden? They may also have access through your garden and numbers twos conservatory.

Jeepers_Creepers

KEMYST said:

LOL! Trust me this is not going to happen. Something positive, for as change - and quite funny!! The f*****g sewer is blocked!! Sewage is coming up all over the patio!!. The sewer is shared between us No1, No2, (next door) and No.3. The first time this happened, I didn`t realise that the sewers were shared

 At that time two gay ladies lived next door. They had had a tiff and one had flushed the other`s underwear down the toilet! So, when Dynorod came to unblock the sewer, they just kept fishing out knickers - dozens of them! I paid the fee but, of course, nobody would own up and pay a share.

Luckily Welsh Water will come to the rescue! They will come around within about 8hours and sort everything out. They even wash the patio down. The last time, I offered them a tip so they could have a pint, and both men refused saying it was just their job

There are good people around!

That is such a good story!

KEMYST

10/10 for Welsh Water. They came 9.30am all cleared and washed down. Bloody wet wipes again! All three of us will get naughty letters. 

Jeepers_Creepers

Did they unblock this for free, Kemyst? Where was the blockage, and which house is the culprit?!

Section62

Jeepers_Creepers said:

Did they unblock this for free, Kemyst? Where was the blockage, and which house is the culprit?!

It should be free because being shared between properties means it is a public sewer* and therefore the responsibility of the sewerage company to maintain.

It also means they could (in theory) take action against anyone causing the sewer to block.

(*assuming it connects to another public sewer, not a septic tank)

KEMYST

There is a jagged edge to the join where the sewer joins to the main sewer out on the street. Thus it is impossible to state who clogged it. There is no charge for unblocking it but its annoying because it when it does, it backs up over our patio. It does this about three times a year. To be fair to us, we know what happens when you flush wet wipes (its always wet wipes and sometimes sanitary towels ) down the loo, we gat a patio full of sewage but if you try and ask others not to do this, you just get an angry exchange so we no longer try - hence the letters to each one of us.

Thanks for the help by the way

KEMYST

Well we saw our solicitor on Friday. In his opinion,

There is an arguable case for the overuse of the right of way. Two solicitors (one free 20 mins) have told us that for an intrusion of the magnitude and for rendering our own patio unusable for 3 weeks there should be some indication on the deeds that this is so. I have to be honest and say I feel a bit iffy about this.

Today we had someone to measure up the end of the patio for a fence panel/door to stretch across the patio. The door will allow them access through the right of way. However, during the measure up the neighbours came out on the patio screaming and shouting "we have a right of way; we have a right of way" We tried to explain that we were not trying to impede the right of way (by installing a door) but they just went nuts every time I tried to speak. In the end I told them to consult a solicitor and walked away. This was very upsetting for my wife and myself.

We want the panel and the door to be made of hard wood so that we can varnish it and make it a feature at that end of the patio. It will, of course, be built on our land but very close to the boundary. Can anyone think of an objection they can make to stop the installation? The solicitor has advised us to put a lock on the gate and give them a key. What would features would you advise toward off any future problems? We have already thought that the panel, in an emergency, must be removable so they can get to the wall for maintenance..

The panel/door is our fall back position. We have been told that they cannot declare the boundary position within 25mm. Thus they will have to determine the boundary professionally - but I don`t think the degree of accuracy will be any where near 25mm even if they employ a land surveyor.

Jeepers_Creepers

I would agree that the 'excessive use' aspect is a tricky one, could be drawn out and costly, and might not even work (did they build their current connie by taking stuff across the RoW? If so, precedence has probably been set. Also, you don't have the 'luxury' of LP...)

Did you ask the solicitor about fitting a gate on your land? Every single article I have found on this makes it 100% clear that you are allowed to do this, and it must be either kept unlocked or a key given to all those entitled to use it.

From looking at your photo, it seems pretty clear that your paved area goes right up to that current gate and yellow wall. It's a pretty safe assumption, then - allowing for what the deeds plans show - that the paved area is 'yours'. So, yes, you can erect your gate and panel on there - I'd keep the furthest edge of the posts a half-inch in from the wall line tobesure tobesure.

Once built, you either leave it unlocked, or give them a key to the lock you've fitted. Let them ponder how they can access the lock to open the gate via a connie door they cannot first open...

So, if you want to nip this whole issue, I think that's something you can do right away.

Them shouting and screaming is upsetting? Yes, I guess it can be. But it's time to move past the emotive, and handle only the issue involved. The next time you see them, just ask calmly "Would you like to talk about this? No? Ok." and walk away, and build your gate.

If "Yes? Good, ok, please let me explain the situation as we see it..." You then put across the main points that need saying. If they interject or become agitated, you stop, look to the side if needed to show you are not engaging with them, and - when they stop - "Please can I continue now." Do not get sidelined by whatever they say - that's a distraction. If necessary, just say "You'll have your chance, please let me finish."

Think through the things you need to get across. I guess:

1) I don't want us to fall out over this - that isn't good for anybody.

2) We know you have a RoW over our land - of course we won't try and stop that.

3) This RoW does not allow for any part of your property - the door or any other part - to come over our land - that is trespass, just as it would be with an opening window or gutter or anything else. You are simply not permitted to do this, just as you wouldn't be with any other house. The RoW makes zero difference, and I have to make it clear to you, we will not allow it.

Depending on how they are reacting, you may wish to allow them their turn at this point - see what they say. But don't be distracted away from the main issues or daft claims.

Then there's;

4) We are allowed to put a gate up on our land, and it is our intention to do this to provide privacy and screening from your conservatory. You will, of course, be given a key.

5) We are happy to discuss any other solutions you may have that could benefit us both.

If they rant or shout, just hold up your hands, palm-forwards in front of you, and calmy say "Do you WANT to talk about this or not?" Turn and walk away if they rant.

Take back control. You have it - that gate is literally the key.

Oh, and record this.

Norman_Castle

KEMYST said:

We want the panel and the door to be made of hard wood so that we can varnish it and make it a feature at that end of the patio.

I wouldn't varnish it. The varnish will fail and allow moisture underneath.

KEMYST

Thanks JC..You are right of course! But its hard man!

Norman:....No coating at all then?