Meter check or smart meter?

Biggus_Dickus

@Anita85   some superb advice upthread, btw.

Here’s my input (for what it’s worth!)

If your leccy meter is clocking up 300w of continuous rogue power that you can’t really account for then it’s costing you (depending on tariff) perhaps £1.10 per day or £33/month

If I were you I’d be asking for a ‘smart’ meter to be installed asap;...if the extra 300w leccy usage goes away then all well and good. If the extra 300w leccy usage continues then at least you’ll know the issue lies somewhere other than your leccy meter.

However, if fitting a ‘smart’ meter proves that your present leccy meter was the culprit then I’m not sure where that would leave you in terms of claiming back the extra leccy cost that the faulty meter has burdened you with.

You’re in something of a quandary the moment. There’s no easy way for you to monitor if your leccy meter is clocking up 300w of continuous power usage when your consumer unit switched off completely;...when your consumer unit is ‘off’ completely the leccy meter digital display should not change at all, but due to the limitations of the digital display you’d probably need to leave the consumer unit switched off for many! hours to confirm whether the meter has incremented the display by just 1KWh. (1KWh = 3.33hrs at 300W continuous consumption)

Your other alternative is to have the meter checked. If the meter is faulty it’s a win-win for you;...however, if the meter proves to be working correctly you’ll be handed a bill and the original problem will still be with you,...albeit you’ll know that the 300w is being consumed by something other than your leccy meter.

That’s assuming of course, you fully accept the engineers findings that the meter is in perfect working order!...I don’t know if I’d be fully convinced.

At least a new ‘smart’ meter will preclude any metering issues;...in addition the smart meter is ‘free’.

Good luck whichever direction you take.

 

 

 

 

  

 

Tallerdave

The meter has an LED that flashes on and off for every 1/1000th kWh, so it's very easy to see it counting electricity when the consumer unit is off. 

Gerry1

Biggus_Dickus said:

You’re in something of a quandary the moment. There’s no easy way for you to monitor if your leccy meter is clocking up 300w of continuous power usage when your consumer unit switched off completely;...when your consumer unit is ‘off’ completely the leccy meter digital display should not change at all, but due to the limitations of the digital display you’d probably need to leave the consumer unit switched off for many! hours to confirm whether the meter has incremented the display by just 1KWh. (1KWh = 3.33hrs at 300W continuous consumption).

Using a domestic clamp-on energy monitor might give useful information / ammunition.  Probably costs about a month's worth of the unexplained energy usage, so a gamble worth taking.  Afterwards the OP might find it useful to see whole-house energy consumption at a glance to get a better understanding of energy usage by various appliances.  A sprat to catch a mackerel, so probably a gamble worth taking.  Alternatively, it could then be sold on Ebay.

Might even be possible to borrow one from friends or family?

Tallerdave said:

The meter has an LED that flashes on and off for every 1/1000th kWh, so it's very easy to see it counting electricity when the consumer unit is off. 

Unfortunately that would not be an independent check so the OP wouldn't know any more than she does at the moment.  If the meter has gone rogue thinking that 300W is always being drawn, the LED will flash 1000 times and the count will notch up by 1kWh in less than four hours.  But neither the OP nor the forumites will be any the wiser as to whether it's a rogue meter or there's some mysterious unexplained connection that really is drawing that current.

If the energy monitor confirms that there's a 300W load with the consumer unit switched off then it's a simple choice between calling in an electrician before getting the meter tested.

It may also be possible to get a check meter installed in series with the suspect meter.  This may well be cheaper than having the suspect meter removed and sent away to a laboratory.

Again there are several possibilities:-

• Ask your supplier how much they would charge to fit a check meter for a few weeks.  As it needs two visits it might not be significantly cheaper than getting the suspect meter sent to the laboratory, but presumably the OP wouldn't have to pay if the check meter's readings differ from those of the suspect meter.

• Buying a meter (can be obtained for £20 or less) and getting an electrician to fit it in series with the official meter.  Unfortunately that requires an official to remove the company fuse, so the costs need to be ascertained to see whether it's worthwhile.  But could be useful because it could stay in situ long term and would be useful if the problem is intermittent.  Regular side by side photos would provide useful evidence.

Some online searches and a few phone calls would give the OP an idea of the best way to proceed.

However, getting a smart meter would be a mistake.  If the usage goes back to normal levels the evidence will be lost because the rogue meter will have been recycled or sent to landfill so there will be no way getting a refund, and if the usage remains excessive then the OP is little the wiser and will have to call in an electrician to investigate the house wiring.

Gerry1

Unlikely to be an immersion heater.

The OP's flashing LED test suggested a mysterious load of 336W, whereas a 'secret' immersion heater would be clocking up around 3kW and the LED would be flashing at least 50 times per minute.

Meter faults are fairly rare, e.g. it's virtually impossible for a disk type to spin with no load, but many modern ones seem to be far less reliable.  It's increasingly looking like a meter fault but it just needs some methodical detective work to minimise the risk of a big bill if it turns out to be OK.

Anita85

@Bigus_dickus
Sorry I've just checked the loft. I don't have a tank in the loft 🤦‍♀️. 

 @Gerry1
Energy supplier did say it would be a check meter installed alongside my existing meter. If it's not faulty I have to pay the fee.

I received another email from them yesterday with possible date (end of August) to fit smart meters. I'm in the process of replying to them. I'll include overnight reading and meter sanity test and kettle test. I also have some questions regarding meter check test, which hopefully they'll answer. It's been hard getting any answers from them. 

I am also looking for a clip on energy monitor to do test @Gerry1 suggested and also to monitor what I'm using.

As far as smart meters go, from what I understand they transmit data through a mobile signal. What happens if for one reason or another you have a bad or no mobile signal? Do they estimate your bill? Or do they get you to read the meter? As I'm pretty sure that my present meter is faulty I wouldn't want estimates on my recent usage. I know you get an energy monitor so you can track your usage but if I buy a clip on energy monitor I'll have that anyway. It doesn't bother me having to read the meters so is it worth having a smart meter?

At the moment I'm swaying more to check meter but need to do other test and depending on result possibly get electrian in. 

Anita85

@Gerry1
I've just read your last comment. If you don't mind me asking in your opinion are smart meters better than modern ordinary meters?
Obviously if it's proved to be faulty I'll have to have a new meter and I've done some research and apparently at the moment you can still choose smart or ordinary. Although I suppose eventually it could become mandatory? 

niktheguru

Gerry1 hates smart meters so he will say no.

When it comes to getting your meter changed you will be getting a smart meter. Beis have stated that suppliers are allowed to change end of life or faulty meters to smart meters. If you insist on a dumb meter you will likely be charged for the inconvenience. There are barely any dumb meters left in circulation. If your smart meter cannot connect to the network then you will be told and then you'll be asked to give readings.

I have smart meters and am very happy with them. I still keep an eye on my usage and readings but they're great.

Don't be sacked in by the hype of people saying your smart meters can be disconnected remotely. The official number of people who were disconnected by the supplier for their electricity or gas last year was 1 person.

Gerry1

niktheguru said:

Don't be sacked in by the hype of people saying your smart meters can be disconnected remotely. The official number of people who were disconnected by the supplier for their electricity or gas last year was 1 person.

@niktheguru It's not hype, the functionality for Time of Use tariffs (i.e. expensive at peak times), Load Limiting (use more than a kWh or two and you'll be switched off) and Load Shedding (i.e. remote disconnection) are all built in, just search online.  You would be well aware of this if you had read the specifications.  Surely you're not so naïve as to believe that this was just done for the fun of it and to waste shedloads of money?  It's not what happened last year that counts (they're keeping their powder dry by not publicising these abilities), it's what is likely to happen in a few years' time that matters.

Getting back on track, the accuracy of a smart meter and a modern non-smart meter are unlikely to vary significantly because the measuring equipment is much the same, only the two-way comms equipment, the privacy concerns and remote disconnection facilities are different.

The key point is that by switching to a free smart meter and seeing whether the consumption drops means that the OP probably won't be able to claim for any overcharging because the evidence will have been recycled or sent to landfill.

Gerry1

Anita85 said:

@Gerry1
I've done some research and apparently at the moment you can still choose smart or ordinary. Although I suppose eventually it could become mandatory? 

Various Secretaries of State promised parliament that they would always be optional, but that's was never really true because it was never the real intention.  Suppliers get heavily fined if they don't meet government installation targets, so non-smart tariffs are often more expensive to force their take-up.

Ofgem used to promise that smart meters 'aren’t compulsory and you can choose not to have one installed' but last January they quietly reneged on that promise, now warning that 'Unless there is a good reason not to, suppliers must install a smart meter if they are replacing a meter or installing a meter for the first time, such as in a new property.'.  So the gloves are starting to come off.

niktheguru

Gerry1 said:

niktheguru said:

Don't be sacked in by the hype of people saying your smart meters can be disconnected remotely. The official number of people who were disconnected by the supplier for their electricity or gas last year was 1 person.

@niktheguru It's not hype, the functionality for Time of Use tariffs (i.e. expensive at peak times), Load Limiting (use more than a kWh or two and you'll be switched off) and Load Shedding (i.e. remote disconnection) are all built in, just search online.  You would be well aware of this if you had read the specifications.  Surely you're not so naïve as to believe that this was just done for the fun of it and to waste shedloads of money?  It's not what happened last year that counts (they're keeping their powder dry by not publicising these abilities), it's what is likely to happen in a few years' time that matters.

Getting back on track, the accuracy of a smart meter and a modern non-smart meter are unlikely to vary significantly because the measuring equipment is much the same, only the two-way comms equipment, the privacy concerns and remote disconnection facilities are different.

The key point is that by switching to a free smart meter and seeing whether the consumption drops means that the OP probably won't be able to claim for any overcharging because the evidence will have been recycled or sent to landfill.

Gerry, I'm fully aware it's in the "specifications" I just don't agree that it should be used to cause mass hysteria towards the masses who are asking about adoption. Smart meters do a lot to stamp out the robbery that is estimated bills. The fact is, if you pay your bills on time you're not going to get disconnected. Load shifting and Limiting may well happen in the future but you'd be a fool if you think its just going to be for smart meter customers and not for non smart meter customers. Instead they will discount tariffs for smart meter customers and encourage loads loadshifting, and just make the non smart customers pay more. To be honest I think if people started getting disconnected at times of the day without a big monetary incentive there'd be an outcry and a very quick reversal from government.

I of course respect individuals right to avoid/reject getting a smart meter, but it's an agree to disagree stance.

It's a bit like saying don't take the covid  jab because there are lots of potential complications/side effects. There's always a risk with everything in life!