Side Extension Plan

gab3x

Hi, I wanted to soundboard my ideas for side extension before I start talking to builders to get quotes. BTW, I did phone a few companies but they were all busy and booked months in advance and could not be even bothered to discuss quotes at this stage (live in Surrey).. but that's another story.

The aim of the project is to create more living space (est 12m2) and add another bedroom at the first floor. I cannot extend into loft or first floor due to roof height and aspect and local planning restrictions. I don't 'need' the extra space but I want to enjoy it for a few years and hopefully add value and profit when it comes to selling the house down the line.

The scope of work would be:

GF

• Side extension (12m2) with removing of two now external walls to create large open space
• New side extension roof to have large skylights
• Move toilet from SE and create a larger bathroom by and under the stairs
• Create a new L shaped kitchen at the E wall and bathroom
• New flooring, new electricity and piping everywhere, as needed

First Floor

• Create bedroom and a small toilet where the bathroom is now
• Move the boiler for CH to GF

So here is floor plan as is:



I have remade the as is GF in a 3D planning software:



And here is what the extension would look like:



So as you can see I have extended into the side garden, moved bathroom from at the end of the house to by and under the stairs. The kitchen is at the north side as L shape next to bathroom. The new roofs created would have large skylights as per image below.

Here is view of space from the kitchen:


So my questions:

• Any considerations I should make on any of the ideas here?
• Do you have any idea at a likely cost of such works? (I live in Surrey)
• I know GF bathrooms and windowless bathrooms at that, are not to everyone's liking. I am a city dweller so I know they can be great if done properly but would it turn a lot of buyers away or just some?
• Most houses in my street which are of same floor-plan and size have simply added either a bigger bathroom in GF at the S end of the house or made upstairs big bathroom much smaller (4m2) and added a tiny bedroom (5m2) making the house a three-bed. Interestingly, there isn't a price premium on these when it comes to sale over the two bed.
• In you opinion would this add to value of my property and by how much? Prices hover at £700-800/sq ft here 

Thanks!

ComicGeek

You can't just remove the supporting structure for the first floor walls, there needs to be something substantial there. What if the only affordable answer is that you can't have the bifolding doors at the rear because there needs to be a column there, and there are columns in the open plan kitchen - would you still want to do it?

I'm not surprised that the builders weren't willing to quote, they really haven't got anything to quote against at the moment. You need to get some proper design and structural input before approaching them for costs.  

There's nothing wrong with doing work that's for your benefit and doesn't add significant value to the house price in other peoples' eyes - we've just done the same here to get a tv snug area into our kitchen and a bigger bathroom above, but we've been here for 11 years already and unlikely to move for another 20 years or so. But you need to be clear on what you are looking to achieve with this, as currently I don't think your ground floor layout will work - would be worth speaking to a couple of designers (architectural technologists and/or structural engineers, doesn't need to be expensive architects) about how that space could work structurally.

gab3x

ComicGeek said:

You can't just remove the supporting structure for the first floor walls, there needs to be something substantial there. What if the only affordable answer is that you can't have the bifolding doors at the rear because there needs to be a column there, and there are columns in the open plan kitchen - would you still want to do it?

I'm not surprised that the builders weren't willing to quote, they really haven't got anything to quote against at the moment. You need to get some proper design and structural input before approaching them for costs.  

There's nothing wrong with doing work that's for your benefit and doesn't add significant value to the house price in other peoples' eyes - we've just done the same here to get a tv snug area into our kitchen and a bigger bathroom above, but we've been here for 11 years already and unlikely to move for another 20 years or so. But you need to be clear on what you are looking to achieve with this, as currently I don't think your ground floor layout will work - would be worth speaking to a couple of designers (architectural technologists and/or structural engineers, doesn't need to be expensive architects) about how that space could work structurally.

Hi - the bifolds full length would be great but having a steel structure/column with glass floor to ceiling pane on one end (W) and bifold on the other (E). Having said that, I absolutely see your point re having to check this with architects first.

Financially this has to make sense to me in form of it has to pay for itself. If the cost ends up being say £60k I want to recoup and make some profit on this when it comes to selling it. If median price per sqft is £750 then 12m2 (130 sq ft) is £97.5k but market might not respond that way. Property is so expensive here, you really have to watch every %.

As for the builders - we didn't even get to a stage where I sent them this.. 

Rosa_Damascena

I like the plan you have come up with - esp moving the location of the cloakroom - but would caution against having a small main bathroom for 3 good sized bedrooms. Use a sun pipe for the cloakroom and you can sacrifice the window, but you will of course need it ducted out as well to avoid a damp problem.

Your kitchen seems to be south east facing not north? Again go for sun pipes to borrow light from elsewhere.

The cost is not going to be as low as £70k though, so manage your expectations accordingly. As for profit: it's Egham, you're never going to lose money.

weeg

That is going to cost huge sums of money. There's nothing holding up the first floor on that plan.

So, you either compromise massively to get a simple supporting structure. Or you compromise a wee bit less and get a tricky structure which costs way more. Both ways include a lot of steel and new foundations.

I can't imagine any sale price could offset the cost. 

gab3x

Great feedback re support structure. I have now added two pillars (one hidden in external wall and other hidden in a shelving unit by the kitchen and beams hidden in plaster. There is no more a single large bifold but smaller bifold and picture window.



and view from kitchen (the roof would be pitched with skylight but I have no idea how to get that done in the software I am using

twopenny

Looks lovely on the plan.
A huge investment in time money and agrivation. Are you sure that this is what the market wants in your area?
Who are your target market? 
I'd be inclined to move the cloakroom and either improve the bathroom (maybe your neighbours know something) or,if feasible, put in an ensuite which can sell a property even when it's not needed.
Extra bedrooms are ok but need to be a reasonable size for extra price. I've seen some the size of a cupboard with extra price. That doesn't work. People aren't fooled.
Have a dig around rightmove for a few weeks similar areas. See what sells similar properties.
One thing that stands out to me is how small the entrance is and your proposed corridor. If people are squeezing to get in before they get to the open space and each time they take a coffee to the lounge it s not good. Same with a viewing. Squeeze to get to the kitchen then squeeze to view the lounge. Though this may just be the way the plan looks.

weeg

From your first plan, the long beam is nearly 8m, so probably a 305mm beam min. Allow another 50mm for plasterboard. Do you have the head height for a 350mm downstand? 

gab3x

twopenny said:

Looks lovely on the plan.
A huge investment in time money and agrivation. Are you sure that this is what the market wants in your area?
Who are your target market? 
I'd be inclined to move the cloakroom and either improve the bathroom (maybe your neighbours know something) or,if feasible, put in an ensuite which can sell a property even when it's not needed.
Extra bedrooms are ok but need to be a reasonable size for extra price. I've seen some the size of a cupboard with extra price. That doesn't work. People aren't fooled.
Have a dig around rightmove for a few weeks similar areas. See what sells similar properties.
One thing that stands out to me is how small the entrance is and your proposed corridor. If people are squeezing to get in before they get to the open space and each time they take a coffee to the lounge it s not good. Same with a viewing. Squeeze to get to the kitchen then squeeze to view the lounge. Though this may just be the way the plan looks.

The bedrooms upstairs would be 12m2, 9m2, and 8m2. There would be a small lavatory too so you don't have to go downstairs to use a loo.

Market - a house of same layout but different roof structure, has come up recently with exactly same side extension plus loft extension at £760k, it was sold within a week.

gab3x

weeg said:

From your first plan, the long beam is nearly 8m, so probably a 305mm beam min. Allow another 50mm for plasterboard. Do you have the head height for a 350mm downstand? 

I already have plenty of headspace, 350mm won't look too disruptive visually either

Rosa_Damascena

gab3x said:

twopenny said:

Looks lovely on the plan.
A huge investment in time money and agrivation. Are you sure that this is what the market wants in your area?
Who are your target market? 
I'd be inclined to move the cloakroom and either improve the bathroom (maybe your neighbours know something) or,if feasible, put in an ensuite which can sell a property even when it's not needed.
Extra bedrooms are ok but need to be a reasonable size for extra price. I've seen some the size of a cupboard with extra price. That doesn't work. People aren't fooled.
Have a dig around rightmove for a few weeks similar areas. See what sells similar properties.
One thing that stands out to me is how small the entrance is and your proposed corridor. If people are squeezing to get in before they get to the open space and each time they take a coffee to the lounge it s not good. Same with a viewing. Squeeze to get to the kitchen then squeeze to view the lounge. Though this may just be the way the plan looks.

The bedrooms upstairs would be 12m2, 9m2, and 8m2. There would be a small lavatory too so you don't have to go downstairs to use a loo.

Market - a house of same layout but different roof structure, has come up recently with exactly same side extension plus loft extension at £760k, it was sold within a week.

Anything TW goes like hot cakes for high prices. Its a highly sought after family area with good schools, not far from the posh parts of the SW London 'burbs with excellent transport into town and access to the M3 and M25. Even a run down public convenience would sell for a small fortune.

As I said earlier, I wouldn't worry about making money on it or shifting it once its time to move on.