Advice needed on extended garden to match neighbours

Rosa_Damascena

Extending into garden with no compromise to access is no biggie, as its what you're neighbours have done. Plonking an outbuilding in that space there would be - but that's not what you are proposing to do?

Eta: how do the neighbours on the far RHS access the rear of their gardens. Are they completely closed off?

Norman_Castle

They keep saying no but what will they do if you fence it? If you match what they have done including a gate which they have a key to they will have the access they need. Are you friendly with the other neighbours who have access over the properties, what do they think about your plans and the objection? At worst you, and possibly your neighbour can be forced to remove any obstruction of the row but if you fence it on the understanding it may not be permanent and avoid placing obstructions such as a shed reinstating it for access would be straightforward.

I wouldn't compromise by fencing off paths for him. He has access across the property which is all thats needed. His argument about property values can be countered with a neighbour dispute about access (which could equally affect you) and your need to reverse out of a garage. You could also argue he has created the situation by making your garage very difficult to access. 

Rosa_Damascena

Norman_Castle said:

They keep saying no but what will they do if you fence it? 

Why invite WW3? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKJXtTLmy_s

ashe

AdviceNeeded18 said:

So from my talk with the neighbour today, I got the following information:

• They do not want to build a garage or park vehicles on their property
• If they were to use this gate, it would only be to bring bags of materials such as gravel in to the garden
• They do not want us to extend purely as it affects their property value
• They believe the RoW only extends towards the road, so they do not care about us not being able to drive in and out if we wanted to replace our current garage and store our car there
• Under no circumstances are we allowed to extend our garden and put a gate which they have access to - as this doesn't constitute as the same level of right of way as which they have as they'd have to ask us (I said we'd give them a key for the lock so I don't know how this applies).

I then suggested the two compromises:
1. We extend the garden but leave ample space for arms-width length for them to walk through to their current gate.
2. We extend the garden but leave ample space however we cover the current gate and if they want to maintain access, they will have to move the gate to the end of their fence.

I sympathise with their point about not wanting to affect resale value, but the current area behind our garage is a total mess. It's been a constant battle with fly tippers so it's covered in rubble, massive pot holes, overgrown weeds and occasional rats from when people flytip. Wouldn't leaving it a mess and being legally obliged to note to the next seller about a neighbours dispute affect the property value more?

Tell him to do one. It's exactly what he has done, which in his terms must have devalued his neighbours property but he didnt mind that happening. Don't ask permission, just do it, and mirror exactly what he has done - none of this 70% conversion and making compromises for someone who hasn't done so themselves

Norman_Castle

Rosa_Damascena said:

Norman_Castle said:

They keep saying no but what will they do if you fence it? 

Why invite WW3?

Why accept a hypocrite dictating what you can do? You're assuming "WW3", the neighbours options are legal with the associated costs or accept it. The ops options are to  accommodate a hypocritical neighbour who has already stated his position or to proceed on the understanding they may need to revert to how it is now at some later date.

Aspiration

I’d check all of the deeds for the properties. 

We had a shared driveway and this mostly benefited our neighbour.

When I pointed out that she was parking in the turning circle she vehemently denied that we were allowed onto her property at all.

After mediation with a solicitor she finally stopped complaining and I informed her that I would be using that turning circle highlighted on the deeds on her driveway.

Funnily enough after this we agreed a joint way of moving forward and sharing costs for a separate access.

If your neighbour on the left has taken any turning circle shown on the deeds away from you then this would be your counter argument for removing your access. 

Rosa_Damascena

Aspiration said:

I’d check all of the deeds for the properties. 

We had a shared driveway and this mostly benefited our neighbour.

When I pointed out that she was parking in the turning circle she vehemently denied that we were allowed onto her property at all.

After mediation with a solicitor she finally stopped complaining and I informed her that I would be using that turning circle highlighted on the deeds on her driveway.

Funnily enough after this we agreed a joint way of moving forward and sharing costs for a separate access.

If your neighbour on the left has taken any turning circle shown on the deeds away from you then this would be your counter argument for removing your access. 

How much did that cost you?

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

AdviceNeeded18 said:

So from my talk with the neighbour today, I got the following information:

• They do not want to build a garage or park vehicles on their property
• If they were to use this gate, it would only be to bring bags of materials such as gravel in to the garden
• They do not want us to extend purely as it affects their property value
• They believe the RoW only extends towards the road, so they do not care about us not being able to drive in and out if we wanted to replace our current garage and store our car there
• Under no circumstances are we allowed to extend our garden and put a gate which they have access to - as this doesn't constitute as the same level of right of way as which they have as they'd have to ask us (I said we'd give them a key for the lock so I don't know how this applies).

I then suggested the two compromises:
1. We extend the garden but leave ample space for arms-width length for them to walk through to their current gate.
2. We extend the garden but leave ample space however we cover the current gate and if they want to maintain access, they will have to move the gate to the end of their fence.

I sympathise with their point about not wanting to affect resale value, but the current area behind our garage is a total mess. It's been a constant battle with fly tippers so it's covered in rubble, massive pot holes, overgrown weeds and occasional rats from when people flytip. Wouldn't leaving it a mess and being legally obliged to note to the next seller about a neighbours dispute affect the property value more?

Best to check your deeds to see if you have access to your property only or across the whole access strip.

If only to yours then I'd knock down the garage, extend the garden to there, put a gate across the access road and use that space for something (like parking the car or storing stuff) that can easily be reversed if anyone further along starts demanding to be able to use the access road. 

If you have access across the whole road I would point this out to your neighbour and then do as you wish, they won't be able to complain you are blocking their access if you can also complain they are blocking yours.  

Slinky

Have you tried speaking with your other neighbour and seeing if they are interested in getting rid of their garage, extending garden etc, in order to stop the flytipping issues? Will be much harder for difficult neighbour to stop the pair of you doing what he has done.