Deferred Pension help please.

JAG61NZ

Thanks for all other links.

I know the RPI figures that they have used for the deferred Pensions as I have asked various questions to try to come up with a manual figure.

I asked the following WTW replies are in italics

a) Please could you confirm the annual % increases applied to the NON GMP portion of a deferred Pension from 1998 to 2021.

( I already have most but have a few gaps)

1. 1998 – 3.7%      1999 – 1.3%      2000 – 3.3%      2001 – 1.9%      2002 – 1.0%      2003 – 2.9%      2004 – 3.0%            2005 – 2.9%      2006 – 3.3%      2007 – 4.4%      2008 – 4.6%      2009 – 0.0%     2010 – 5.0%      2011 – 5.0%

2012 – 2.8%      2013 – 3.3%      2014 – 2.6%      2015 – 1.0%      2016 – 1.6%      2017 – 3.5%      2018 – 3.4%            2019 – 2.9%      2020 – 1.1%

b) If the RPI was negative, what did you do. Did you negatively reduce the pension for future calculations or leave the value as it was ?

1. If RPI is negative the pension remains the same
   
   

c) In my case I left Barclaycard Computer Systems in Nov 1997. My increase letter in September 1998 declared an increase of 3.7% for a full year but pro rata for missing months. Am I correct in assuming I received 11/12th of 3.7%? Giving me my first increase of 3.39% ?

Your understanding is correct

d) As the figures for 2021 are not yet available and I have already received a Quotation for my retirement in December 2021 what happens to the NON GMP increase for 2021 when does that get applied? If I have been quoted an annual pension of NON GMP of 12345 do I receive 12345 or 12345 plus the increase I would have received in October 2021? Do I miss out on this increase? Can you give me new figures in August?

1. The annual 2021 increase will be applied to your pension in October. However as the normal retirement quotation is using statutory revaluation rates the value of your benefits is unlikely to change.

e) Once no longer deferred and in Payment , when the next review takes place for the NON GMP value in August 2022 will I receive a full year's entitlement or do I miss out and only receive from December 2021?

1. If you retire at NRD the increase in 2022 will be 10/12ths of the annual increase amount. If however you elect to take early retirement prior to 1 October 2021 you will receive a pro-rata increase from the early retirement date to 1 October 2021 and then a full annual increase in 2022.

JAG61NZ

I do still have some letters from Barclays which tell me the percentage applied to my pension and state it HAS increased and from what date is will be applied which is usually the October following the yearly review. Its not a maybe in the future or a revalued figure it is a definite increase. Unfortunately I have only kept a few letters. I never received any documentation to say increases would no longer apply and all current and past documentation say the 5% rule. When I queried the worth of my current Pension in 2014 the Customer Service Guy sent me the revaluation Report for 2014.

JAG61NZ

I have sent WTW the following question 

With reference to Answers A B and C and the % increases already applied to the in excess NON GMP portion of my pension

I calculate the following. Please could you check my calculations as I believe this is the figure my NON GMP is already at as it

was deferred so increased annually.

JAG61NZ

My letter in 1998 states an increase in my deferred Pensions excess, and that my Pension has increased as of October 1998 now would that be classified as Post 97 pension build up. Its just a theory.

xylophone

I am rather confused myself now!


First of all, when exactly did you leave Barclays? I ask because you have stated

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6275266/deferred-pension-help-please/p1

My Pension dates are between May 1988 - Nov 1997.

Then https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78403587/#Comment_78403587

I actually got my dates wrong I am May 88 to Nov 96.

Then  https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78405980/#Comment_78405980

In my case I left Barclaycard Computer Systems in Nov 1997. 

Then, with regard to the pension you are shortly to be drawing, you state

I received a report on the 27th May 2021 showing the revaluation of the excess to that date of 5353.08 but 
the quote is showing
Guaranteed Minimum Pension 9GMP) built up after 5 April 1988      3948.36
Scheme Pension (over the GMP) built up before 6 April 1997            4955.69
Total Scheme Pension at Retirement                                                   8904.05
At state Pension Age your scheme pension will be reduced by           331.22 a year

But you have now stated

I have already received a Quotation for my retirement in December 2021 what happens to the NON GMP increase for 2021 when does that get applied? If I have been quoted an annual pension of NON GMP of 12345 

To help clarify the situation, can you state what exactly your statement of benefits at date of leaving the scheme says in respect of

Post 88 GMP

Excess

Then, it appeared from your earlier posts that you thought that once your pension came into payment, you would not be receiving any increases in excess of the up to 3% CPI on your revalued post 88 GMP.

However, it appears that WTW have advised you that you will be receiving increases as under scheme rules for the excess as well as the increases up to 3% CPI on the revalued GMP?

JAG61NZ

Yes sorry Xylophone

My dates are May 1988 to Nov 1996.

The 12345 was an example for them to follow should have used X. They have offered 4955.69 

I have actually been following your train of thought and I believe you have hit it bang on the nail as the figures come out exactly.

They look to have used - Sorry I apologise in advance if it comes out a real mess as I can not yet use any linking.

STATUTORY INSTRUMENTS

2020 No. 1332

PENSIONS

The Occupational Pensions (Revaluation) Order 2020

Made

20th November 2020

Laid before Parliament

24th November 2020

Coming into force

1st January 2021

1st January 1996 - 31st December 2020

79.2%

My Pension at 8 Nov 1996 was

GMP built up 778.44
Scheme Pension (Over gmp) built up before 6 April 1997 2765.45
Total Scheme 3543.89
 State Pension deduction 331.22


Using the following

1st January 1996 - 31st December 2020 79.2% increase and Scheme Pension (Over gmp) built up before 6 April 1997 2765.45


2765.45*1.792 = 4955.6864 rounded 4955.69

which is what they have offered me for the excess on my quotation. This is less than a 5% scheme rule.

JAG61NZ

Do I need to ask why they have used the Orders instead of the Scheme rules or am I just banging my head against a wall ?

So all the scheme information for me is not true.

JAG61NZ

WTW have not said what will happen once in payment and to be honest I asked so many questions of them that may have got overlooked. I will need to ask the questions simply to get a reply I think and not bombard them . 

xylophone

Do I need to ask why they have used the Orders instead of the Scheme rules or am I just banging my head against a wall ?

I think it's worth checking in view of the fact that you are told

Normal Retirement Date;
 
Guaranteed Minimum Pension at date of leaving + Excess Scheme Revalued to NRD at Scheme Revaluation rate (or Statutory Revaluation if higher) = Annual pension

And you can simply ask WTW to confirm how your pension escalates in payment,

As far as I can see   your revalued GMP as at NRA will increase by CPI up to 3% and your excess revalued excess will increase  by RPI up to 5%?

JAG61NZ

Thanks Xylophone. I have sent an email to them asking about Pension in payment for GMP and above GMP and also when will it be applied and how will I be informed.

I will be back when I have some answers. Many thanks for your help thus far certainly helps having someone to talk to