Disputed property sale

naedanger

I think I would be telling your wife's brother he is free to arrange the sale of the property on the open market subject to him not selling it for less, after expenses, than your current offer.

Meanwhile get on with selling your own. If he realises if he wants it done his way he needs to do the work himself he might be more accommodating of your option.

And if he does proceed to market the house make sure not to agree to pay any expenses until you have been refunded for the ones you have incurred already.

xylophone

To my mind her brother, no matter how greedy, untrustworthy or unreasonable, has every legal right to refuse to sell to us sell and that we can’t do anything about this. 

 He and your wife named as joint executors on the Grant?

He can refuse to sell his share to you but he cannot sell to anybody else without the joint exor's consent (except by court order)?

sassyblue

Mason47 said:

Thanks to all. 

Yes we’ve tried to explain and every reasonable approach we can think of. It’s become obvious this is going to be hell if we pursue it and so have decided to cut our losses and let the house go. He’s gone back on his word and his fathers wishes and that’s for him to own and live with. We just want him out our lives now. 

My advice would be to carry on and get father in law's house if you want as the idiot brother is actually better off getting the money from you.

I really just wanted to say that family members can be pigs. My own sister decided out of nowhere that mum wasn’t coming to dads funeral and caused a huge argument the night dad died.  She’s a narcissist, an absolute nightmare but thinks she’s an innocent little victim. We have cut her from our lives too but she will continually pop up like a bad smell, she thrives on drama. 

Robert_McGeddon

OP, I think you've received some pretty good feedback so far.  I note you've decided to sell the house in the estate. Nevertheless, a couple of general points for your consideration:

1. The roles of Executor and Beneficiary are different, even if both are performed by the same person (or people in your case.)  The Executor seeks to distribute the estate according to the will and maximise as far as reasonably possible the amounts going to the beneficiaries. In your case each Executor should try to maximise the sums going to both beneficiaries. If 50% of the net proceeds from selling the house are less than what you would pay your brother for acquiring the whole house then, technically, you are both failing in your duties as Executors. (In practical terms, if the Executors are also the only Beneficiaries then agreement between them would take precedence. Your brother may not know this.)  Is your brother aware that as Executor he must maximise your distribution as far as practicable, just as you should maximise his?

2.  For dispute resolution I think finding an independant voice is usually helpful.  You and your brother have different views on the house sale and that's OK. Which one is better?  Given the legal responsibilites of being executors you might ask your brother to join you in consulting a solicitor on Executor duties and options on the house arising therefrom. The initial half-hour is usually free.  You could then proceed with or without the solicitor.

Mason47

Thanks again all. 

I’m afraid we have tried every reasonable way possible to inform the brother in law of his duties and the differences between an executor and a beneficiary. He refuses to pay any attention. He is so paranoid from years of drug use he just thinks people (including the solicitor) are out to get “his” money. He still doesn’t even understand that nothing is yet his, he thinks everything became his automatically the second his father died and doesn’t understand the process if probate. Simply, he is not fit to be an executor but removing him through the courts we want to avoid if possible. 

I’ve not before mentioned he has threatened violence upon us over these matters, verbally abused us both as well as tried to extort money from my wife. He’s tried to sell his fathers belongings, even items he wanted gifted to friends and family. I’ve unwillingly sat in the background and not reacted as my wife wanted to try pacify him and try talk sense to him. A few days ago I decided to step out the shadows and told the boy where to shove the house and himself and of the consequences of any further harassment towards his sister. 

Yesterday he contacted an estate agent and was told they would put the house on the market for less than I offered and less than it was valued a few weeks ago for probate, so along with fees, he will be at least 15k worse off, as will my wife. As a result he has come crawling back asking if I will buy again. 

This is the second time he’s tried to screw us over then come crawling back. 

I personally think it would be foolish to once again attempt any kind of financial dealings with him. He cannot be trusted at all. I could demand he get a power of attorney for someone to act on his behalf during the sale but.....

Were having a think about it. 

waveneygnome

How confident are you in being able to sell your house?
Could you get a loan/bridging loan to facilitate a swift purchase of the 50% share? (To get the Brother out of your hair)

Mason47

waveneygnome said:

How confident are you in being able to sell your house?
Could you get a loan/bridging loan to facilitate a swift purchase of the 50% share? (To get the Brother out of your hair)

The house will sell. A bridging loan would cost over 30k in extra stamp duty, fees and interest. Even then, I’ve still got to trust he will actually sign the house over.
He’s now talking of leaving the country until next spring stating he can’t be expected to stick around to sign paperwork. He’s a bloody nightmare. Why his father decided to make his drunken, coke head, paranoid, half mad delinquent son a co executor I’ll never know. No way we can buy his half. Best we can hope for is that probate can be completed without him causing too much expense and damage. 

Keep_pedalling

Mason47 said:

waveneygnome said:

How confident are you in being able to sell your house?
Could you get a loan/bridging loan to facilitate a swift purchase of the 50% share? (To get the Brother out of your hair)

The house will sell. A bridging loan would cost over 30k in extra stamp duty, fees and interest. Even then, I’ve still got to trust he will actually sign the house over.
He’s now talking of leaving the country until next spring stating he can’t be expected to stick around to sign paperwork. He’s a bloody nightmare. Why his father decided to make his drunken, coke head, paranoid, half mad delinquent son a co executor I’ll never know. No way we can buy his half. Best we can hope for is that probate can be completed without him causing too much expense and damage. 

It does sound like your FIL made a terrible error of judgement with his choice of second executor. If he is really serious about getting out of the country (which I doubt) then maybe the solicitor could persuade him to give him power of attorney to act for him. 

Mason47

Keep_pedalling said:

Mason47 said:

waveneygnome said:

How confident are you in being able to sell your house?
Could you get a loan/bridging loan to facilitate a swift purchase of the 50% share? (To get the Brother out of your hair)

The house will sell. A bridging loan would cost over 30k in extra stamp duty, fees and interest. Even then, I’ve still got to trust he will actually sign the house over.
He’s now talking of leaving the country until next spring stating he can’t be expected to stick around to sign paperwork. He’s a bloody nightmare. Why his father decided to make his drunken, coke head, paranoid, half mad delinquent son a co executor I’ll never know. No way we can buy his half. Best we can hope for is that probate can be completed without him causing too much expense and damage. 

It does sound like your FIL made a terrible error of judgement with his choice of second executor. If he is really serious about getting out of the country (which I doubt) then maybe the solicitor could persuade him to give him power of attorney to act for him. 

Hi, yes, indeed. He was a fair man and I guess thought he was being fair. 

The solicitor has already spoken to him about that. He refused. He trusts nobody. 

The solicitor has also suggested to us that we remove him from his duties though the courts, which we’ll have to do soon if he doesn’t come to some kind of sense. 

It’s all just such a shame to see that nice old man’s life’s work be wasted away through probate due to his greedy idiot son. 

TBagpuss

Maybe agree with him that the house should be sold on the open market, get it on with the agents then once any offer is received, offer £5K more . You can be clear you are paying open market value as you have tested the open market.