Ticket displayed upside-down

vanbanger

Hi everyone
Back in 2016, my partner parked in a private parking lot ran by UK Parking Control Limited.  She bought a ticket but allowed our then toddler to put it in the window and he put it the wrong way up.  She got a ticket, rang the number explaining that we did have a ticket but it was the wrong way up.  They told her on the phone that in that case they would drop it and we didn't have to do anything.  But sadly we have no proof that this conversation took place.

Now (5 years later!) they've passed the matter on to a bailiff company called dcbl who want £160 from us to resolve the matter.  I still have the original parking ticket and sent them a scan of it to prove that we did pay for the parking.  They responded by sending us a photo of it in its upside-down orientation, and are threatening the commencement of legal action against us to recover this fine.

Are they bluffing?  I know that you can't just ignore private parking tickets nowadays but would a judge really come down on their side if we did pay the ticket and the only error was that it was displayed incorrectly?

Many thanks in advance for any insights...

Le_Kirk

Did you read the NEWBIE sticky before posting (It does say that in the announcements on the front page of the forum)?  Is it DCB Legal or DCB Limited?  Is it a letter before claim or is it a debt collector letter.  You can find the difference in the NEWBIE sticky - start with the second post.

Umkomaas

Looks like another rash of DCB Limited debt collection drivel on behalf of UKPC is now hitting doormats!  This is what I posted just a few minutes ago to a newbie receiving the same letter - parking circumstances different, but the drivel isn't. My advice to him applies to you too. 

You can safely ignore DCB Limited. The NEWBIES FAQ sticky, fourth post, tells you how to deal with debt collectors. 

Whether UKPC will pursue a single parking ticket through the courts is open to conjecture. Their usual MO is to go after multiple unpaid tickets, usually above £600. You're not at this stage.

UKPC's usual solicitors are SCS Law, so watch out for any correspondence from them. DCB Limited's involvement is purely debt collection, but their sister arm is DCB Legal, and at this stage they are not involved in litigating on behalf of UKPC, but nonetheless, watch out for anything from them. Come back on this thread if you get anything from SCS or DCB Legal.

vanbanger

Thanks for the response, I have skimmed the newbie sticky which seems to be suggesting that we should face them down rather than paying, although it makes no mention of our particular circumstance (upside-down ticket).
It is DCB limited who are sending letters, and as far as I can make out it isn't a "letter before claim", it describes itself as a "Final Notice of Debt Recovery".

Regarding the advice to not say who was driving, the letter we sent to them includes the line "I bought a pay and display ticket and I still have it".  Possibly this line could be construed as an admission of who was driving?  Would this be likely to affect the outcome? 

Fruitcake

It is not a fine.

You have received a debt collector letter and it can be safely ignored. However, you can expect a court claim in the near future. If you were close to the six year deadline then it would be worth engaging with DCB Limited in the hope you could delay it long enough to become statute barred, but if you still have a year to go, I doubt that would work.

It is never too late to get a landowner cancellation, so that is still Plan A. Where did the alleged event occur?

Send an SAR to the UKPC as per the advice in the NEWBIES. Send a copy of the vehicle V5C as proof of ID, or two unredacted utility bills or bank/card statements. Do not send photo ID. This will flush out the original NTK to see if the keeper can be held liable.

Do not identify the driver at any point.

vanbanger

The event took place in a plot of land next to curzon street in birmingham.  It used to be a parcel force depot and now it's the site where the HS2 terminus is to be built but in the interim it was used as a private car park, so I've no idea who the land actually belonged to and they are unlikely to be very traceable.  I will "send an SAR to the UKPC" as advised, thank you

vanbanger

The newbies thread says I should send an SAR after I receive a "Letter Before Claim", which I don't think I have had yet, is this correct?

KeithP

vanbanger said:

The newbies thread says I should send an SAR after I receive a "Letter Before Claim", which I don't think I have had yet, is this correct?

Only you know whether or not you have sent a Subject Access Request to the parking company or not.

If not, then, as you say, now is the time to do so.

Fruitcake

Send the SAR asap. You will then be able to use information received in your defence. If you leave it until after you have received the LBC you may not get the results back in time.

Johnersh

In this scenario I'd not be too concerned about naming the driver as the honesty and integrity of producing a clear witness statement showing that
A. That a ticket was bought
B. You were advised it would be rescinded
C. There is no loss (by which I mean pecuniary or otherwise since unlike Beavis there is no overstay or other infringement)
D. Claim is disproportionate and the breach de minimis insofar as there was substantial compliance with all terms and no party has suffered

Send a pdf copy of the ticket and make the above points. Tell them that you reserve the right to produce the correspondence to the court. 

Coupon-mad

If you want to read how fluttering ticket cases go at court stage, search the forum for the words fluttering defence or fluttering claim.  Not 'upside down'.