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Surprise CCJ Dilemma

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Comments

  • Grizebeck said:
    Which court (hearing date ) and claimaint please?

    It's Wakefield County Court, rescheduled for Friday v Excel Parking Services.
  • @Coupon-mad - thank you so much for this.  I spent much of the night reading and re-reading POFA to be able to demonstrate my understanding to the judge.  However...I am struggling to identify the non-compliance. In relation to keeper liability - The NTK states "we will have the right to recover from the registered keeper, any unpaid balance of the parking charge".  Is this enough for the judge to say they are compliant without the claimant having made reference to liability or POFA itself?

    4.  The Claimant has not complied with the relevant statutory requirements, not least insofar as the Notice to Keeper ('NTK') fails to properly (or at all) warn the keeper of any potential liability.  Schedule 4 POFA, para 8(2)f - or 9(2)f for postal notices - is omitted. The NTK states that the driver is liable and it also misstates the period of 28 days, wrongly suggesting that the mandatory timeline set in Schedule 4 (paragraph 8(2)f or 9(2)f as the case may be) runs from 'the date of the notice'. 

  • Jenni_D
    Jenni_D Posts: 5,473 Forumite
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    edited 2 November 2022 at 12:49PM
    Look carefully at what their NTK actually says vs what 8(2)f / 9(2)f of PoFA actually say. PoFA says "28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given" ... if the NTK just says 28 days then they cannot lawfully invoke PoFA; the wording in PoFA is prescriptive and leaves no leeway for interpretation.
    Jenni x
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 155,731 Forumite
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    edited 2 November 2022 at 12:49PM
    Surely it misstates the 28 days as running from the 'date of the notice'?

    Given what you've told us the NTK says, you can remove this phrase "states that the driver is liable and it also" (just leaving 4 saying that the 28 days is misstated).
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
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    Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Thanks @Coupon-mad and @Jenni_D

    Here's what I think their mistake is:

    POFA 8 (2) (f) states the creditor must in the NTK warn the keeper that, if at the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice to keeper is given [the given date being specified in 8 (6) as the second working day after the day on which it is posted] the creditor will (if all applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid.

    Timescales stated in the NTK are inaccurate and therefore not compliant with POFA.

    The PPC contradict themselves in the bottom left paragraph of the NTK by giving two different dates from which the 28 days commence.

    The first commencement date of the 28 days is given as 24th February 2017.  The NTK reads “if, after a period of 28 days beginning with the day after the Issue Date of this Notice” (the issue date being stated in the NTK as 23rd February 2017) “the amount of the unpaid Parking Charge specified in this Notice has not been paid in full…we will have the right to recover from the registered keeper, any unpaid balance of the Parking Charge.

    The second date for the 28 days to commence is 27th February 2017.  In the same paragraph in the bottom left corner of the NTK the PPC states “This Notice will have deemed to have been received by you on the second working day after the Issue Date” which is 27th February 2017 – two working days after the day in which the NTK is posted. 


  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 155,731 Forumite
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    edited 2 November 2022 at 5:24PM
    I wouldn't bother with the second bit because that could be considered by the Judge to be correct.

    You need to get this and the 2 authorities emailed within an hour. Before 4pm! The actual transcripts.  3 PDFs attached to an email with the subject line I gave you.

    You are very late to be submitting stuff and have already breached a court order by not filing and serving any WS or evidence, so this was provided for you last night to urgently try to rescue your case. Not to waste any hours trying to perfect it.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
    Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • @Coupon-mad

    Sorry, I wasn't trying to perfect the skeleton argument.  It's really helpful as it is and I'm really appreciative of your assistance.  The NTK does say the day after the issue day and not the day of the notice so I had to change the wording slightly to be accurate.  It's all been sent through, so I'll keep everything crossed for Friday.  Thanks again.
  • UPDATE - I Lost

    Judge said:
    *   NTK was compliant with POFA so able to recover charge from registered keeper
    *   Was very familiar with the car park, driving past it most days, and would find it hard to believe that anyone could park in the car park without failing to realise it was a 24 hour pay and display as lots of signs and very well lit

    Have to pay the original £100 fine but not the added £60.  Plus £25 and £27 for court fees and the claimant's legal costs of £50 - so a total of £202 
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