Estate Agents fees

peweuk

We recently put our house up for sale and engaged an estate agent for a fee of £4000.

We instructed them on the basis that we were looking for a sale to complete during late August to early Sept to fit in with our timescale as we were going to rent for 6 months to meet the completion of the build of our new property in Feb/March 2022.

We did, however, say that if the right buyer wished an earlier completion we would be happy to negotiate with them as long as we were compensated for the extra rental costs of renting sooner than budgeted for.

We have had several viewings and are waiting for feedback, but yesterday as I left the house a woman who had been sitting in her car for a few minutes in front of our house began to drive away. She saw me leaving the house and stopped asking if ours was the house up for sale. I said it was and asked if she was interested in arranging a viewing.
She replied no, saying she had only popped past the house on her way home from other viewings locally 'to be nosey'. She said she had spoken to the agent who told her we were not interested in offers unless the potential buyer was happy with a Sept completion, so she refrained from asking to arrange a viewing as she needed completion by the end of June. 

I told her that we had instructed the agent that if anyone wanted to complete earlier than Sept and was happy to consider covering our additional rental costs we were happy to negotiate - at which point she asked if she could arrange a viewing for today as she was interested in the property having seen the outside/location and would be happy to consider negotiating for the right property, stating that had I not been leaving the house at the time I was, she said she would have driven off and looked to find a property elsewhere,

 I would be interested in the view of others with regard to the Estate Agent's fee should this lady make an acceptable offer and if we sold the property to her. After all, had I not left the house when I did we would probably never known about her enquiry.

moneysavinghero

Are you asking is the EA due the fee?

Answer is yes. She clearly stated that she knew about the property from the EA. They have introduced her (even if not formally).

user1977

peweuk said:

 I would be interested in the view of others with regard to the Estate Agent's fee should this lady make an acceptable offer and if we sold the property to her. After all, had I not left the house when I did we would probably never known about her enquiry.

And presumably if they hadn't advertised it, she wouldn't even have been there. And if she makes an offer and that progresses to a sale, the EA will be doing all the work you'd expect them to do. Of course they'll still be due their fee, what were you proposing?

Stubod

..of course you need to pay the agency their fee, why do you think you wouldn't?

AdrianC

peweuk said:

We recently put our house up for sale and engaged an estate agent for a fee of £4000.

We instructed them on the basis that we were looking for a sale to complete during late August to early Sept to fit in with our timescale as we were going to rent for 6 months to meet the completion of the build of our new property in Feb/March 2022.

We did, however, say that if the right buyer wished an earlier completion we would be happy to negotiate with them as long as we were compensated for the extra rental costs of renting sooner than budgeted for.

Why on earth did you complicate it so much?
Just sell asap, and rent for the interim, however long that may be.

Talk about making a rod for your own back...

Apart from anything else, good luck finding a landlord who'll be happy with an expected 6mo tenancy, rather than wanting a minimum 12mo term, preferably ongoing - and you seem to be assuming there won't be any delays in the build, 10 months and a winter into the future, at the tail-end of a pandemic and with Brexit affecting materials and labour supply...

Weathergirl_76

The fee would be due to the EA, as they introduced the property to her (from wherever she saw it advertised) and has spoken to the ea about it.

steampowered

Even if that buyer has an offer accepted tomorrow, it is unlikely that she will be completing in June.

Conveyancing normally takes longer than that. The EA knows this.

It sounds like you might have unreasonable expectations around the house buying process:
- Good luck finding a buyer who is going to "compensate you" for having to rent longer. It's just part of negotiating a price.
- Most tenancies are minimum 12 months. Short term tenancies are generally only possible in large cities (e.g. London) and are vastly more expensive than regular tenancies.
- You'll be lucky if your new build is finished on time. 

Tiglet2

peweuk said:

We recently put our house up for sale and engaged an estate agent for a fee of £4000.

We instructed them on the basis that we were looking for a sale to complete during late August to early Sept to fit in with our timescale as we were going to rent for 6 months to meet the completion of the build of our new property in Feb/March 2022.

We did, however, say that if the right buyer wished an earlier completion we would be happy to negotiate with them as long as we were compensated for the extra rental costs of renting sooner than budgeted for.

We have had several viewings and are waiting for feedback, but yesterday as I left the house a woman who had been sitting in her car for a few minutes in front of our house began to drive away. She saw me leaving the house and stopped asking if ours was the house up for sale. I said it was and asked if she was interested in arranging a viewing.
She replied no, saying she had only popped past the house on her way home from other viewings locally 'to be nosey'. She said she had spoken to the agent who told her we were not interested in offers unless the potential buyer was happy with a Sept completion, so she refrained from asking to arrange a viewing as she needed completion by the end of June. 

I told her that we had instructed the agent that if anyone wanted to complete earlier than Sept and was happy to consider covering our additional rental costs we were happy to negotiate - at which point she asked if she could arrange a viewing for today as she was interested in the property having seen the outside/location and would be happy to consider negotiating for the right property, stating that had I not been leaving the house at the time I was, she said she would have driven off and looked to find a property elsewhere,

 I would be interested in the view of others with regard to the Estate Agent's fee should this lady make an acceptable offer and if we sold the property to her. After all, had I not left the house when I did we would probably never known about her enquiry.

Unfortunately, neither you nor the EA can commit to any deadlines or appropriate compensation, when you are talking about the sale and purchase of property in England or Wales.  Setting a deadline of August or September might be feasible, but the legal transfer of ownership is the necessary work that your conveyancing solicitor does and it is only when they see and review all the paperwork, that they can advise whether your dates are realistic or not.  If the dates are not realistic, those deadlines will change whether you like it or not.  I wish people understood, before making conditions on timescales that suit themselves, that deadlines are meaningless until the solicitors have all the documentation necessary and have reviewed it.

We are now in May.  Your potential buyer is very unlikely to complete by June in any case.  I assume your potential buyer was doing a drive by and parked outside your property because she had seen the advert from the EA.  Therefore the EA would be due their fee.

Your "conditions" are not legally binding and I would be very surprised if a potential purchaser agrees to them.

You have plenty of time before your new build is ready.  You may as well sit back and relax, let the EA find a buyer without all your additional conditions.  When the conveyancing work has reached the latter stages, you can then look for a short term rental/air bnb to bridge the gap between the completion of your sale and purchase. 

It was your choice to put the property up for sale 9 months before your new build is ready (at the earliest) and no-one else should be compelled to compensate you for this.

amandacat

I am 3 months in on trying to buy a chain free property (chain free both ends) and I am looking at least another month. Things are so slow at the moment, like others have said-there is no way she would achieve a June completion unless she is a cash buyer and doesn't want any enquiries or searches. I would tell your EA to avoid telling people about the Aug/Sept completion, by the time you have an offer and start going through the legal process you will be working to that timescale anyway.

eddddy

Tiglet2 said:
I assume your potential buyer was doing a drive by and parked outside your property because she had seen the advert from the EA.  Therefore the EA would be due their fee.

That's not a correct example of an 'introduction'.

Following a decision in the court of appeal, the Property Ombudsman is clear that seeing an advert, or seeing a "For Sale" sign is not an 'introduction'.  Here's how the ombudsman defines an 'introduction':

18j Effective Introduction. An effective introduction must evidence that the agent carried out an act that initiated the buyer’s reaction to the property. As such, there is a need for a defined transaction event to occur. This can be most clearly evidenced by an agent carrying out a viewing.

Link: https://www.tpos.co.uk/images/Codes_2019_a5/TPOE27-8_Code_of_Practice_for_Residential_Estate_Agents_A5_-_Effective_1_June_2019.pdf

However, the OP says that the EA had a discussion with the person about the property - perhaps that would count as a "defined transaction event" or "introduction".

Additionally, the OP needs to read their EA contract. If it is a "Sole Selling Contract", the OP would typically have to pay the EA a fee, even if they didn't introduce the buyer.

Tiglet2

@eddddy thanks for clarifying!