London 2 bed flat. Over 1 week listed but only 1 enquiry/viewing - please critique!

kieran3184

Issue is also your flat is more Tooting Bec than Balham, you cannot command Balham prices

musehead

getmore4less said:

Owleyes00 said:

Sorry me again, I just did the similar listings thing and I think you are priced too high.

this flat is the same price as yours and has a private balcony and much bigger kitchen in a similar sort of building 

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86384266#/

Drop it by £20k and see how you do

problem is that is still for sale and been on a while suggesting that one is also overpriced.

its the SSTC that need to be compared those are the ones people have viewed and made offers of.


I did not get as far as looking at the sold prices in my previous more like this analysis

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78271605/#Comment_78271605

full matrix for 1/2 mile

	1bed	2bed	3bed+
0-425	33/18	5/4	2/4
0-450	40/22	10/6	2/4
0-475	51/23	12/9	3/4
0-500	57/25	30/14	4/5
0-550	59/26	53/21	5/5
0-600	59/26	76/33	7/8
0-max	59/27	117/63	47/27

its those 14 and the 5x3beds that need looking at to compare.

here are 8  in the 475-500 bracket SSTC.
1/4
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78957591
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86017753

1/2
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/88439047
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/83467111
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78169356
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/97957805
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104273435
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85199752

and the first 7 over 500 that are SSTC

£510  
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90200488

£530 
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895350

£550
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/103828643
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895368
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78719751
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/101661860
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/87531583



also handy on RM listing is the direct link to the Sold data

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/sw17-7at.html

nothing in the block of interest but go out 1/4m a few but no listings, 1/2m again lack of listing needs more research on the candidates.

this sold for 500k   Dec 2020



AS for the "Patio"   first two pictures kind of shout look at this great outside space fenced off

Is the bit next door has outside the door also communal why is there a privacy fence between?

looking at the planning(2002/3002) it looks to plan.
https://planning.wandsworth.gov.uk/Northgate/PlanningExplorer/GeneralSearch.aspx

Those one beds on the ebd are their terrace areas also communal 


From the plans it looks like to get from the underground parking you have to come up at the end where the shops are then go outside round you patio  then in the door  next to your patio

That's a right trek if you have stuff.

Thanks for your detailed analysis getmore4less.

Regarding the patio area, yes the trellis fencing and planters are all to plan according to the planning application drawings (all have been in place since it was built). The reality is that it was set up as if they are private patio areas - why the developer has done this, I don't know. It would have made much more sense with this setup if the lease included the patio area. The other 4 flats with patios have the same situation - in fact one of them has added extra trellis fencing along the front to make it more private! And nobody is aware that it's a communal area.

But I obviously need to be more clear in the listing and let buyers decide themselves on viewing if they are happy with it.

In fact, there is an internal doorway direct from the parking garage into the main building, maybe not clear on the plans. That way also has a lift, so most people enter the building that way from the garage, particularly if they have stuff.

Dusk1983

Speaking as someone who just sold a London 2 bed flat (with private balcony) at great difficulty, I’m still surprised people haven’t realised the “boom” only applies to houses. The gap between flat and house demand is so large, it’s a chasm. And nobody is really talking about it, which is bizarre.

We quickly found out the market for flats is an absolute race to the bottom and you either accept that or stay put and hope things recover. Our decision was the former, because the gap between flat values and house prices is already huge and only going to increase.

It’s also not just sellers who haven’t caught up with this reality yet but agents too, who frankly are deceiving flat owners that they can participate in this “boom”.

Ours was listed at 450 which might in fairness have been a realistic price pre-Covid. Dropped to 425 which I felt was spot on. Dropped to 400. In total, 25 viewings, no offers. 

We ended up accepting a cash offer from a BTL for 380 to just move on with our lives.

getmore4less

musehead said:

getmore4less said:

Owleyes00 said:

Sorry me again, I just did the similar listings thing and I think you are priced too high.

this flat is the same price as yours and has a private balcony and much bigger kitchen in a similar sort of building 

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86384266#/

Drop it by £20k and see how you do

problem is that is still for sale and been on a while suggesting that one is also overpriced.

its the SSTC that need to be compared those are the ones people have viewed and made offers of.


I did not get as far as looking at the sold prices in my previous more like this analysis

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78271605/#Comment_78271605

full matrix for 1/2 mile

	1bed	2bed	3bed+
0-425	33/18	5/4	2/4
0-450	40/22	10/6	2/4
0-475	51/23	12/9	3/4
0-500	57/25	30/14	4/5
0-550	59/26	53/21	5/5
0-600	59/26	76/33	7/8
0-max	59/27	117/63	47/27

its those 14 and the 5x3beds that need looking at to compare.

here are 8  in the 475-500 bracket SSTC.
1/4
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78957591
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86017753

1/2
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/88439047
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/83467111
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78169356
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/97957805
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104273435
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85199752

and the first 7 over 500 that are SSTC

£510  
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90200488

£530 
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895350

£550
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/103828643
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895368
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78719751
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/101661860
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/87531583



also handy on RM listing is the direct link to the Sold data

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/sw17-7at.html

nothing in the block of interest but go out 1/4m a few but no listings, 1/2m again lack of listing needs more research on the candidates.

this sold for 500k   Dec 2020



AS for the "Patio"   first two pictures kind of shout look at this great outside space fenced off

Is the bit next door has outside the door also communal why is there a privacy fence between?

looking at the planning(2002/3002) it looks to plan.
https://planning.wandsworth.gov.uk/Northgate/PlanningExplorer/GeneralSearch.aspx

Those one beds on the ebd are their terrace areas also communal 


From the plans it looks like to get from the underground parking you have to come up at the end where the shops are then go outside round you patio  then in the door  next to your patio

That's a right trek if you have stuff.

Thanks for your detailed analysis getmore4less.

Regarding the patio area, yes the trellis fencing and planters are all to plan according to the planning application drawings (all have been in place since it was built). The reality is that it was set up as if they are private patio areas - why the developer has done this, I don't know. It would have made much more sense with this setup if the lease included the patio area. The other 4 flats with patios have the same situation - in fact one of them has added extra trellis fencing along the front to make it more private! And nobody is aware that it's a communal area.

But I obviously need to be more clear in the listing and let buyers decide themselves on viewing if they are happy with it.

In fact, there is an internal doorway direct from the parking garage into the main building, maybe not clear on the plans. That way also has a lift, so most people enter the building that way from the garage, particularly if they have stuff.

I could see that doorway into the front lobby with the lift but there is no access to your flat I can see from lobby

only access is going to the entrance next to your patio via the terrace or via the roller doors to the steps..



Do the ones on the end still have their  private decked areas as that what was on the plans
 

RoisinDove

Dusk1983 said:

Speaking as someone who just sold a London 2 bed flat (with private balcony) at great difficulty, I’m still surprised people haven’t realised that this “boom” only applies to houses. The gap between flat and house demand is so large, it’s a chasm. And nobody is really talking about it, which is bizarre.

We quickly found out the market for flats is an absolute race to the bottom and you either accept that or stay put and hope things recover. Our decision was the former, because the gap between flat values and house prices is already huge and only going to increase.

It’s also not just sellers who haven’t caught up with this reality yet but agents too, who frankly are deceiving flat owners that they can participate in this “boom”.

Ours was listed at 450 which might in fairness have been a realistic price pre-Covid. Dropped to 425 which I felt was spot on. Dropped to 400. In total, 25 viewings, no offers. 

We ended up accepting a cash offer from a BTL for 380 to just move on with our lives.

I'm mostly looking at one beds and even the ones with no outside space seem to be selling pretty fast. It's unusual that I view a place and it isn't gone within a couple of weeks. I'm wondering if they are in fact all selling for way less than the listed price - there's no way for me to check this, is there? Or perhaps the 'lower' end of the market (300K and under) is still doing better because the people who can afford 450K are moving further out and buying houses?

musehead

getmore4less said:

musehead said:

getmore4less said:

Owleyes00 said:

Sorry me again, I just did the similar listings thing and I think you are priced too high.

this flat is the same price as yours and has a private balcony and much bigger kitchen in a similar sort of building 

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86384266#/

Drop it by £20k and see how you do

problem is that is still for sale and been on a while suggesting that one is also overpriced.

its the SSTC that need to be compared those are the ones people have viewed and made offers of.


I did not get as far as looking at the sold prices in my previous more like this analysis

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78271605/#Comment_78271605

full matrix for 1/2 mile

	1bed	2bed	3bed+
0-425	33/18	5/4	2/4
0-450	40/22	10/6	2/4
0-475	51/23	12/9	3/4
0-500	57/25	30/14	4/5
0-550	59/26	53/21	5/5
0-600	59/26	76/33	7/8
0-max	59/27	117/63	47/27

its those 14 and the 5x3beds that need looking at to compare.

here are 8  in the 475-500 bracket SSTC.
1/4
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78957591
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86017753

1/2
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/88439047
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/83467111
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78169356
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/97957805
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104273435
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85199752

and the first 7 over 500 that are SSTC

£510  
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90200488

£530 
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895350

£550
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/103828643
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895368
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78719751
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/101661860
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/87531583



also handy on RM listing is the direct link to the Sold data

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/sw17-7at.html

nothing in the block of interest but go out 1/4m a few but no listings, 1/2m again lack of listing needs more research on the candidates.

this sold for 500k   Dec 2020



AS for the "Patio"   first two pictures kind of shout look at this great outside space fenced off

Is the bit next door has outside the door also communal why is there a privacy fence between?

looking at the planning(2002/3002) it looks to plan.
https://planning.wandsworth.gov.uk/Northgate/PlanningExplorer/GeneralSearch.aspx

Those one beds on the ebd are their terrace areas also communal 


From the plans it looks like to get from the underground parking you have to come up at the end where the shops are then go outside round you patio  then in the door  next to your patio

That's a right trek if you have stuff.

Thanks for your detailed analysis getmore4less.

Regarding the patio area, yes the trellis fencing and planters are all to plan according to the planning application drawings (all have been in place since it was built). The reality is that it was set up as if they are private patio areas - why the developer has done this, I don't know. It would have made much more sense with this setup if the lease included the patio area. The other 4 flats with patios have the same situation - in fact one of them has added extra trellis fencing along the front to make it more private! And nobody is aware that it's a communal area.

But I obviously need to be more clear in the listing and let buyers decide themselves on viewing if they are happy with it.

In fact, there is an internal doorway direct from the parking garage into the main building, maybe not clear on the plans. That way also has a lift, so most people enter the building that way from the garage, particularly if they have stuff.

I could see that doorway into the front lobby with the lift but there is no access to your flat I can see from lobby

only access is going to the entrance next to your patio via the terrace or via the roller doors to the steps..



Do the ones on the end still have their  private decked areas as that what was on the plans
 

Ah yes I see what you mean. You're right, if you enter via the front lobby (through the front door on the main road, or from the garage) you need to go through the door onto the terrace and then access my flat from there. Alternatively you can go via the garage roller doors or the driveway and up the steps onto the front of the terrace without going into the main front part of the building. Most people go up the outside steps to the front of the terrace to access these flats in the back part of the building.

On the far left of the plans, there's 3 flats with private patio areas. They are not accessible by anyone else. I don't know what the situation is regarding the lease for those flats though.

I've attached an image of the plan I'm referring to if anyone is interested! Red arrow pointing to my flat.

Dusk1983

RoisinDove said:

Dusk1983 said:

Speaking as someone who just sold a London 2 bed flat (with private balcony) at great difficulty, I’m still surprised people haven’t realised that this “boom” only applies to houses. The gap between flat and house demand is so large, it’s a chasm. And nobody is really talking about it, which is bizarre.

We quickly found out the market for flats is an absolute race to the bottom and you either accept that or stay put and hope things recover. Our decision was the former, because the gap between flat values and house prices is already huge and only going to increase.

It’s also not just sellers who haven’t caught up with this reality yet but agents too, who frankly are deceiving flat owners that they can participate in this “boom”.

Ours was listed at 450 which might in fairness have been a realistic price pre-Covid. Dropped to 425 which I felt was spot on. Dropped to 400. In total, 25 viewings, no offers. 

We ended up accepting a cash offer from a BTL for 380 to just move on with our lives.

I'm mostly looking at one beds and even the ones with no outside space seem to be selling pretty fast. It's unusual that I view a place and it isn't gone within a couple of weeks. I'm wondering if they are in fact all selling for way less than the listed price - there's no way for me to check this, is there? Or perhaps the 'lower' end of the market (300K and under) is still doing better because the people who can afford 450K are moving further out and buying houses?

Yep, my guess is that investors like ours are taking advantage of desperate sellers, and snapping up bargains 

You can check sold prices on Rightmove a few months after completion

getmore4less

RoisinDove said:

Dusk1983 said:

Speaking as someone who just sold a London 2 bed flat (with private balcony) at great difficulty, I’m still surprised people haven’t realised that this “boom” only applies to houses. The gap between flat and house demand is so large, it’s a chasm. And nobody is really talking about it, which is bizarre.

We quickly found out the market for flats is an absolute race to the bottom and you either accept that or stay put and hope things recover. Our decision was the former, because the gap between flat values and house prices is already huge and only going to increase.

It’s also not just sellers who haven’t caught up with this reality yet but agents too, who frankly are deceiving flat owners that they can participate in this “boom”.

Ours was listed at 450 which might in fairness have been a realistic price pre-Covid. Dropped to 425 which I felt was spot on. Dropped to 400. In total, 25 viewings, no offers. 

We ended up accepting a cash offer from a BTL for 380 to just move on with our lives.

I'm mostly looking at one beds and even the ones with no outside space seem to be selling pretty fast. It's unusual that I view a place and it isn't gone within a couple of weeks. I'm wondering if they are in fact all selling for way less than the listed price - there's no way for me to check this, is there? Or perhaps the 'lower' end of the market (300K and under) is still doing better because the people who can afford 450K are moving further out and buying houses?

The first thing to do when you think about marketing market is a "more like this" like the one I did for this one.

Then keep on top of it

It gives you an idea of supply and demand with the forsale/SSTC numbers 
(its changed a bit because the selling process has dragged out a bit so the SSTC can be higher because of that 

You then track all the SSTC as they come through to the land reg which is a few weeks behind (mid Jan and seen Feb on one search)

You can back trace a few of ones already on the land reg to see what they were asking/sold to start your data set. 

I would probably track a few going back to late last year then everything from Jan.
If you don't get enough samples for your type then look at 

GIve me a postcode And I can have a look when I get time.

Alan2020

musehead said:

getmore4less said:

musehead said:

getmore4less said:

Owleyes00 said:

Sorry me again, I just did the similar listings thing and I think you are priced too high.

this flat is the same price as yours and has a private balcony and much bigger kitchen in a similar sort of building 

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86384266#/

Drop it by £20k and see how you do

problem is that is still for sale and been on a while suggesting that one is also overpriced.

its the SSTC that need to be compared those are the ones people have viewed and made offers of.


I did not get as far as looking at the sold prices in my previous more like this analysis

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78271605/#Comment_78271605

full matrix for 1/2 mile

	1bed	2bed	3bed+
0-425	33/18	5/4	2/4
0-450	40/22	10/6	2/4
0-475	51/23	12/9	3/4
0-500	57/25	30/14	4/5
0-550	59/26	53/21	5/5
0-600	59/26	76/33	7/8
0-max	59/27	117/63	47/27

its those 14 and the 5x3beds that need looking at to compare.

here are 8  in the 475-500 bracket SSTC.
1/4
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78957591
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86017753

1/2
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/88439047
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/83467111
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78169356
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/97957805
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104273435
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85199752

and the first 7 over 500 that are SSTC

£510  
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90200488

£530 
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895350

£550
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/103828643
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78895368
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/78719751
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/101661860
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/87531583



also handy on RM listing is the direct link to the Sold data

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/sw17-7at.html

nothing in the block of interest but go out 1/4m a few but no listings, 1/2m again lack of listing needs more research on the candidates.

this sold for 500k   Dec 2020



AS for the "Patio"   first two pictures kind of shout look at this great outside space fenced off

Is the bit next door has outside the door also communal why is there a privacy fence between?

looking at the planning(2002/3002) it looks to plan.
https://planning.wandsworth.gov.uk/Northgate/PlanningExplorer/GeneralSearch.aspx

Those one beds on the ebd are their terrace areas also communal 


From the plans it looks like to get from the underground parking you have to come up at the end where the shops are then go outside round you patio  then in the door  next to your patio

That's a right trek if you have stuff.

Thanks for your detailed analysis getmore4less.

Regarding the patio area, yes the trellis fencing and planters are all to plan according to the planning application drawings (all have been in place since it was built). The reality is that it was set up as if they are private patio areas - why the developer has done this, I don't know. It would have made much more sense with this setup if the lease included the patio area. The other 4 flats with patios have the same situation - in fact one of them has added extra trellis fencing along the front to make it more private! And nobody is aware that it's a communal area.

But I obviously need to be more clear in the listing and let buyers decide themselves on viewing if they are happy with it.

In fact, there is an internal doorway direct from the parking garage into the main building, maybe not clear on the plans. That way also has a lift, so most people enter the building that way from the garage, particularly if they have stuff.

I could see that doorway into the front lobby with the lift but there is no access to your flat I can see from lobby

only access is going to the entrance next to your patio via the terrace or via the roller doors to the steps..



Do the ones on the end still have their  private decked areas as that what was on the plans
 

Ah yes I see what you mean. You're right, if you enter via the front lobby (through the front door on the main road, or from the garage) you need to go through the door onto the terrace and then access my flat from there. Alternatively you can go via the garage roller doors or the driveway and up the steps onto the front of the terrace without going into the main front part of the building. Most people go up the outside steps to the front of the terrace to access these flats in the back part of the building.

On the far left of the plans, there's 3 flats with private patio areas. They are not accessible by anyone else. I don't know what the situation is regarding the lease for those flats though.

I've attached an image of the plan I'm referring to if anyone is interested! Red arrow pointing to my flat.

Looking at this floorplan, it sounds like the terrace is for your use and owned by the freeholder, but they are maintaining it out of others money (unless you pay a higher service charge).  I think they did this to prevent people asking to extend out.  Have you considered approaching the freeholder to lease that bit of land for the same years as your flat for £5K or so, then it becomes your private space and you can plant bamboo, put a trellis etc and make it your own?

Teapot55

I disagree with comments about having two bathrooms. Yes, if you’re the sole occupant, two might seem unnecessary & you could use the ‘family’ bathroom for a bit of storage & just have it as a toilet for any visitors. 

However, if it’s a couple occupying the flat, it’s great for one of them to still be able to get ready to go out etc in peace without having to walk around half-dressed to get to the bathroom & then discover one of your other half’s visitors are in there.