Second hand car nightmare!

Je55lay

I bought a 60 plate Mazda 6 on 16th December from a dealer on the condition they replaced the front tyres as they were worn. Within a week there were various rattles and vibrations. I took it for a service. The ‘new’ tyres were actually reconditioned and the wrong size. A rear tyre had numerous punctures and the car had an oil leak and an issue with a ball joint boot. I replaced all 4 tyres and booked it back in for the boot and oil leak. I then took it for a 200 mile round trip. The EML light came on, there was a loss of power and a loud scraping noise from the engine. I took it back to the garage and they said it was a turbo underboost and the noise was a bad alternator belt so I’d had enough and called the dealer to return the car. They were really nice and offered to fix everything. They collected the car on January 6th. 11 weeks of chasing later, they then said it was repaired but they told me I had to contribute to the repair cost before I could have the car back. I refused and several strongly worded emails later they returned the car. Within a week the EML was back on and the rattles and screeching had also returned. I’ve now told them I want my money back and they’re saying they don’t do refunds but they will source me a replacement car. My questions are:
1. Can they force me to have another one of their cars?
2. How long should I be forced to wait for them to replace it? Bearing in mind it took them 11 weeks to ‘repair’ it last time!
3. What are my rights if the replacement car is also faulty?
4. How do I find out if the replacement car is of the same value as what I paid for the Mazda 6?
5. If I claim through the courts can I also claim back the cost of the servicing, diagnostics and tyres, not to mention 5 months of tax, insurance and breakdown cover I’ve paid out on this car when I’ve only been able to use it for 2 weeks since I bought it?

I’m not really clued up on cars as you can probably tell so please forgive me if I’ve asked a stupid question. I’m just in a total pickle. I’ve got 4 children ranging from 13 down to 6 months old and have been without a reliable car for 5 months now. I just don’t know what to do.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!! Many thanks.

AdrianC

It's an 11yo car you've owned for four months.
Your legal rights are minimal - all faults are judged as to whether they're reasonable to expect from a used car of that age, mileage, relative price, and apparent condition. Bear in mind the average car is 14yrs old at scrapping in this country.

If faults beyond reasonable expectations are found, then they have a legal onus to return your money during the first 30 days.

After 30 days, they have a legal right to repair, replace or refund at their discretion. Within the first six months, the presumption is the faults were present at the time of sale, unless they can demonstrate otherwise.

If you want to exercise your rights above what they agree to, then you need to physically return the car, and launch a small claim for the value. They are not liable for anything above the purchase price.

Grumpy_chap

The key thing the OP does not say anything about is how the car was advertised and presented for sale. 

A 10 yo Mazda 6 could be anything from £couple-hundred spares/repairs through to £5k immaculate one-owner.  Given it was presented with worn tyres needing exchange, I suspect this was not the "immaculate" end of the price scale.

As a purchase from a dealer, was there any warranty?  Why didn't the OP call upon this for the faults that developed in the first week?
Why did the OP pay for for new tyres given part of the agreement for the purchase was that the supplying dealer fitted new tyres as part of the sale?

Sadly, the OP is now out of time for forcing return and refund.  The dealers offer to exchange for an alternative vehicle may be the best that the OP will get from that dealer.  Of course, the OP can P/X the car against any other car from any other dealer, or investigate what the regular car-buying services will offer (WBAC / Motorway) and cut-their-losses to start over.

Herzlos

It sounds like the 30 day thing might be OK as the faults were reported within the first week, it's then dragged on since.

What car is the dealer offering as a replacement? Whilst you could probably force them to take that car back and get money from them through the courts, it may be less hassle to take the replacement if you can satisfy yourself that it's suitable and problem free (insist on an AA/RAC inspection or local mechanic arranged and paid for yourself). There's no point in replacing a lemon with a lemon.

Did the garage give you an estimate to repair it properly? It may also be easier to just go that route.

Je55lay

Thanks Herzlos. Yes, the problem was reported within the first week but because of Christmas and new year closures the earliest the car could be returned was 4th January. 

I have the original advert. It says it’s a ‘fantastic example’, ‘runs and drives perfectly’ etc etc. I bought it for £3k. It came with a 3 month engine and gearbox warranty, and yes I did ask if I could claim on it but it only covers ‘total failure’. 

The dealer took the car back for repairs on 4th January and despite me calling several times a week, only returned it back to me on 25th March. They say they do not have to give me any receipts for work that has been done so I have to take their word for it. 

The car is having exactly the same issues as when I first reported it to the dealer on 22nd December. (The dealer was closed from 21st December to 3rd Jan).

I replaced the tyres because I needed to use it for a 200 mile round trip the next day and the dealer was closed for Christmas. The garage told me I should try to claim the cost back from the dealer but they refused. I have already dealt with the fact I’m unlikely to get the cost of these back now.

So the car came back to me on 25th March and I used it for another 200 mile round trip on 2nd April (I do these trips once a month to facilitate child contact and barely use the car for anything else). After I had dropped the kids with their father the EML came on and I haven’t been able to use it since. 

So I’ve basically done two journeys and both times the EML came on. I haven’t used the car since. So I’ve only really had use of it for 2 weeks and it’s only been in my physical possession for 5 weeks since I bought it on 16th December. 

The dealer has just said they are trying to source a replacement vehicle for me. That was a week ago. They haven’t offered me anything yet. I hope this clarifies things.

My question is do I have to accept whatever they offer me? Can I refuse if it’s unsuitable for my needs or worth less than I paid for the Mazda? Does the 30 day period restart on the new car? Once I get to 6 months do all my rights just disappear or are they on hold because they are aware of the issues?

AdrianC

Je55lay said:

Does the 30 day period restart on the new car? Once I get to 6 months do all my rights just disappear or are they on hold because they are aware of the issues?

No, the 30 days does not restart - the purchase date remains the same.

No, your rights don't totally disappear at 6mo - the balance of proof changes from the supplier proving the fault was not there at the time of supply, to you proving it was.

Herzlos

Je55lay said:

So the car came back to me on 25th March and I used it for another 200 mile round trip on 2nd April (I do these trips once a month to facilitate child contact and barely use the car for anything else).

If you genuinely only use the car once a month for these 200 mile trips, then you'd be much better off just renting a car for the trip.
Book it in advance and it might only cost you £20+fuel for the trip.
Obviously it depends on how far away from a rental place you are and timings, etc.

Je55lay

AdrianC said:

No, your rights don't totally disappear at 6mo - the balance of proof changes from the supplier proving the fault was not there at the time of supply, to you proving it was.

Even though they have been aware of the fault since 22nd December? It is the same fault. EML, turbo underboost and screeching in the engine (possibly a bad alternator belt). Plus oil leak, cracked boot, and dodgy tyres. All things diagnosed by my local garage. The dealer has been aware of all of these for 4 months. They had the car in their possession for 11 weeks saying they were ‘repairing’ it so not exactly my fault it has taken so long. 

So, say I take the replacement car, it breaks down too, and they take it in for ‘repairs’ for another 11 weeks... meanwhile the 6 month period finishes. I’m then entitled to nothing? No refund, no repair, no replacement. 

Grumpy_chap

I'd certainly say that a "fantastic" £3k 10 yo family car should have reasonable expectations higher than the reality that the OP has experienced.

Je55lay

Herzlos said:

Je55lay said:

So the car came back to me on 25th March and I used it for another 200 mile round trip on 2nd April (I do these trips once a month to facilitate child contact and barely use the car for anything else).

If you genuinely only use the car once a month for these 200 mile trips, then you'd be much better off just renting a car for the trip.
Book it in advance and it might only cost you £20+fuel for the trip.
Obviously it depends on how far away from a rental place you are and timings, etc.

I’ve been doing these trips for 8 years, every way imaginable. Train, car, bus, taxi, rental cars, even zip car. The easiest, quickest and most cost effective way to do it is by having my own car. It also helps to have a car for emergencies as hubby takes his car to work leaving me with 4 children all day. I don’t use a car often enough to warrant having a brand new one, but one that works would be nice 😂