*Updated* SUCCESS against BW Legal/UK Parking Patrol Office Ltd

Redx

Rosa_Klebb said:

Redx said:

Alter 2 to state keeper but not the driver , if you were not not the driver !! There is no legal requirement to name the driver , but POFA only protects a keeper who was not the driver , it does not assist a Driver at all. so if you were not the driver , say so !

I do not understand why you mentioned the lack of Beavis , Beavis had nothing to do with residential parking

Leases , landowner authority , signage etc all play a part in residential disputes

Sorry Beavis is mentioned several times in the draft template defense on here, hence why I asked.  Is the draft defense as advised to be used on here not applicable for residential car park tickets?

Yes it is , providing paragraphs 2 and 3 are adapted correctly

Rosa_Klebb

Rosa_Klebb said:

Redx said:

Alter 2 to state keeper but not the driver , if you were not not the driver !! There is no legal requirement to name the driver , but POFA only protects a keeper who was not the driver , it does not assist a Driver at all. so if you were not the driver , say so !

I do not understand why you mentioned the lack of Beavis , Beavis had nothing to do with residential parking

Leases , landowner authority , signage etc all play a part in residential disputes

Sorry Beavis is mentioned several times in the draft template defense on here, hence why I asked.  Is the draft defense as advised to be used on here not applicable for residential car park tickets?

Okay thanks, yes this is what I was seeking advise on.  Have posted paragraphs 2/3 on my second post for review.  Maybe there is some crossed wires going on here as I though from reading the stickies etc. that it was a case of just adding paragraphs 2 and 3, adjusting these for circumstance of course to the template defense?

Redx

Generally speaking , that tends to be correct for most cases , so go with that idea for now , not asking about the rest of the template , wait for feedback , this could take days or weeks before it's as good as can be

When you post your revised paragraphs 2 and 3 , possibly several times , below , they get refined to the nth degree , the process evolves , so don't muddy the waters with references to the rest , yet

And change your keyboard to UK English , to get your spellings correct ( no S in DEFENCE )

KeithP

Rosa_Klebb said:

Rosa_Klebb said:

Redx said:

Alter 2 to state keeper but not the driver , if you were not not the driver !! There is no legal requirement to name the driver , but POFA only protects a keeper who was not the driver , it does not assist a Driver at all. so if you were not the driver , say so !

I do not understand why you mentioned the lack of Beavis , Beavis had nothing to do with residential parking

Leases , landowner authority , signage etc all play a part in residential disputes

Sorry Beavis is mentioned several times in the draft template defense on here, hence why I asked.  Is the draft defense as advised to be used on here not applicable for residential car park tickets?

Okay thanks, yes this is what I was seeking advise on.  Have posted paragraphs 2/3 on my second post for review.  Maybe there is some crossed wires going on here as I though from reading the stickies etc. that it was a case of just adding paragraphs 2 and 3, adjusting these for circumstance of course to the template defense?

Generally, that's all you need to do.
All those Beavis references in the template Defence should remain. If you read them you will see that they are using that Supreme Court Judgment to either explain why your case is different, or why your case is similar in certain respects - with the expectation that a Judge in a lower court, a County Court, will follow that guidance.

Rosa_Klebb

Generally, that's all you need to do.

All those Beavis references in the template Defence should remain. If you read them you will see that they are using that Supreme Court Judgment to either explain why your case is different, or why your case is similar in certain respects - with the expectation that a Judge in a lower court, a County Court, will follow that guidance.

Thank you and appreciate your feedback. Yes will await feedback on my defense (my second post in this thread) and amend accordingly.  Will I be required to send the photos with the defense to prove my points regarding the signage or does this wait until a later stage?  In other words, do I send the whole thing off at this first stage, full detail etc?  For example, i don't believe that they have complied with POFA.  Can I just say this or do I have to elaborate exactly in detail how they have failed to comply at this stage?

KeithP

Evidence comes later. Nothing gets filed with a Defence (again, note the spelling).

You need to read more of the second post of the NEWBIES thread. In particular, Bargepole's 'what happens when' post linked from there.

Coupon-mad

That defence facts section looks a bit long but only because it looks like you've numbered every sentence,  rather than put 3 or 4 sentences together into a paragraph 3, then 4.  Group them together by subject and it will look more concise. 

What you say there in the facts is all useful stuff that you can (later, at WS and evidence stage) elaborate on with photos and your first hand account.  So you are on the right track.

Le_Kirk

4. The vehicle was in use by a relative who, when visiting the Defendant, made appropriate use of the visitors parking space in the residential car park where the Defendant lives.

This is confusing - is it your vehicle that was being used and of which you are the registered keeper?  Is the claim form in your name?  If it was your vehicle, why did the relative have to use a visitor space.  The defence has to explain to the judge as concisely as possible the circumstances surrounding the event.

Rosa_Klebb

Le_Kirk said:

4. The vehicle was in use by a relative who, when visiting the Defendant, made appropriate use of the visitors parking space in the residential car park where the Defendant lives.

This is confusing - is it your vehicle that was being used and of which you are the registered keeper?  Is the claim form in your name?  If it was your vehicle, why did the relative have to use a visitor space.  The defence has to explain to the judge as concisely as possible the circumstances surrounding the event.

Thanks and may take that out.  My main vehicle was in our allocated space, my other vehicle in long term use by a family member who no longer lives with us was using the visitor space.  I'm not sure what it adds in any case.  Sufficient just to say that I was not the driver without confusing matters perhaps?

Castle

Rosa_Klebb said:

Le_Kirk said:

4. The vehicle was in use by a relative who, when visiting the Defendant, made appropriate use of the visitors parking space in the residential car park where the Defendant lives.

This is confusing - is it your vehicle that was being used and of which you are the registered keeper?  Is the claim form in your name?  If it was your vehicle, why did the relative have to use a visitor space.  The defence has to explain to the judge as concisely as possible the circumstances surrounding the event.

Thanks and may take that out.  My main vehicle was in our allocated space, my other vehicle in long term use by a family member who no longer lives with us was using the visitor space.  I'm not sure what it adds in any case.  Sufficient just to say that I was not the driver without confusing matters perhaps?

Sounds like the family member is the actual keeper of the vehicle, not you.